[mjd420nova]

What's wrong with Obama? Why is he afraid to just come out and say it. The U.S. could eliminate our trade imbalance in just one year if we would all just stop buying overseas products and buy AMERICAN. Who cares about NAFTA, lets turn the tables on the whole thing and stop buying products made outside the U.S. and buy our own goods. We could make the country the once proud and sought after producer of quality goods and services. The final step would be to get rid of federal income tax and institute a national sales tax. No more tax cheats or loop holes for the rich to jump through. No one would care how much you made, but if you spend it, you will pay your share. Corporations would also be subject to these taxes when they buy the components from which they build their products. The IRS could be then put to work accounting for all the money that comes in and stop chasing those who think they can side step the laws with hiding their profits and moving their operations off-shore. When the politicians begin listening to their constituents and doing the the countries business instead of lining their pockets with kick backs and bribes to vote for laws and amendments that would benefit only those with the money to buy those politicians. Another can of worms is the death penalty. How do you stop criminals when you have no way to eliminate the repeat offenders and just keep them in jail 'til they die. This country spends more money keeping crooks in jail than we do on educating our children - - that's the real crime and it only perpetuates itself. Does your vote make a difference who gets elected?? So much is wrong with our country, illegal immigrants pour across our borders to get free medical care and schooling for their kids while the real citizens can't get the care they need. We want to be compassionate but must it be at the cost of our own economy and well being.

[LiveBrianD]

And I might as well not even mention healthcare for everybody - something that practically EVERY developed nation out there EXCEPT the united states has.

Also, if there was a high import tax, companies would have less reason to have everything made in China. The problem is that the profit motive is sometimes too much - why use drilling practices that are definitely safe (or, for that matter, even drill at all) when you can use ones that might fail and create a huge spill but save you a bunch of money in the short run?

[coastie65]

NAFTA was a boon to many companies. Look at Toshiba, Samsung, Motorola, and others. If you notice the tag, it will say Assembled in Mexico. Why is this? Since NAFTA, these companies have been shipping the parts to Mexico for assembly, then duty free shipment across the border. As for U.S. Made products, they don.t exist much anymore. You can directly blame the unions for that. With their demands, they have driven companies out of business or offshore. Time for a National Right to Work Law. It you look at the figures, the unemployment picture is much better in the right to work states ( about 6% here in in Virginia ).

As for the trade imbalance, countries cheat ( China anyone ) and manage to export more to the U.S. than they import from the U.S. Anyone stop to think that it may be part of a scheme to bring down the U.S.? They don't dare try Militarily as they know our power in that respect, but by quietly undermining the financial structure through various means, the U.S. can be brought down. With the total irresponsibility and incompetence of the ones chosen to lead, it plays right into their hands. All those billions of dollars spent on useless pet projects ( actually a pay off for their support ).

IBM sold off their Home Computer ( PC ) division to China ( Lenovo now ) along with the Technology, that for years was barred from China. There used to be a thriving steel industry here, but not any more thanks to the unions. There are stil a few, but the product is expensive. I worked for many years for a company that built trucks for utility companies and Fire Trucks. I was in the body fabrication part. For the most part, we used recycled steel as it was cheaper, but of lower quality and created problems during the making of the various parts for the truck bodies. I have worked union in the past. I worked for Union-Camp Corp. ( now a part of International Paper ) making corrugated boxes. I quickly realized that the Union was all about those dues you pay. Their idea of creating jobs is to have five people doing the job of one at a premium price in pay and benefits. A company can't last like that.

I don't know if you'll ever truely get a balance of trade as countries do cheat and get away with it. They won't buy our beef for one reason or another ( usually unfounded ). Food? Farmers in California can't irrigate crops because the state shuts off the water to protect some worthless fish, so don't plant ( same thing here except it was a Hydro Electric Plant and some worthless minnow got in the way ). We could grow enough for our own needs as well as export, but won't happen as long as the do gooders prevail. Species come and species go, such is the nature of things. Being able to feed people should be the priority as well as having something to export. We used to export a lot Corn for feed, but not any more due to the demands of ethanol production, that is so expensive it has to be subsidized by the taxpayers to keep the price down at the pump.

As for a National Sales tax, I am on the fence on that. I don't think it will eliminate the Income Tax as those folks in Washington are a greedy lot and can't get enough money. A rewrite of the tax code would probably be helpful as well as going after those who have offshored their money to avoid taxes. I get a bit tired of hearing about how the "Rich" are shouldering the burden. In the 2004 Elections, they released Theresa Heinz Kerry's Income Tax Filing from 2003. The end result was that with all her money and income, her bracket was at 11.8%. When I was working and making on average about $29,000 per year, I paid on average about 18% to 20%. Granted, her 11.8% was far more than my 18% to 20%, but the fact remains, her tax bracket was far lower than mine and should have been at 30% or higher if you believe the pundents. Yes, as far as evening the playing field as far as taxes go, a National Sales Tax ( consumption Tax ? ) would be much fairer as would an across the board flat tax.

The way I see it, this country is being trashed by the leadership in Washington. I don't agree with much of anything that comes out of there, as it is coming from the radicals on both sides of the aisle ( far Left and far Right ) and is a at cross purposes to the best interests of the country. There are some moderate voices, but they can do little. If you want to get this country back on track, you need to get rid of the business as usual professional politicians and elect responsible and competent people. As long as money is the primary driving force in politics, that won't happen. Anyway, that is enough as this is not mean't to be a political diatribe, but just some personal observations as to why things are as they are today and the reason, we have no jobs or products to export. Truth be told, our biggest export is probably technology that others use to develop products to ship back here.

[mjd420nova]

I didn't even want to get started on the UNION problem. It used to be that the unions provided all the health and welfare benefits. Then they (the unions) got greedy and started hiring and paying for representatives and stewards that did nothing but provide oversight that undermined the companies way to do their business. The unions ruined the "teamwork" aspect of working for any employer. Heaven forbid you would help another worker do part of his job. This was seen as job security. The companies are having their feet held to the flames to follow union guidelines that do nothing but slow down production and create animosity between workers. Companies have now burned their employees by cutting back on the amount they pay for health care, putting a bigger burden on the workers to pay the increasing costs from their own pockets and then being forced by their emplyers to do more work for less pay while they layoff more and more workers. Older workers are being forced out by managements by any method they can come up with. Once out of the work force and unemployed, employers are looking to hire unskilled workers for less pay. This results in the service industry being ripe with idiot workers who don't know their jobs and the customer gets no support. Many repair services, be it computers to washing machines, charge so much money for labor costs and material markups that it is cheaper to buy a new whatever and throw the old one away. This might be good for industries that manufacture those products but places a real strain on landfills. Recycling helps to relieve some of that problem but then they force you to pay for them to pickup those items that they collect more money for when routed to those parts of the recycle market. When will it end?? Will Washington ever see the light and begin to do the nations business and stop filling their pockets at the cost of the citizens. And they call that PUBLIC SERVICE??

[techie4fun]

I think it's cheap and poorly thought out the Government's able to get rich leaving the rest of us practically lifeless. It's a sad world, and I don't think President Obama's helped at all. Free health care has ruined everything. Military Dependents have been forced to switch doctors because the doctors aren't allowed to accept TRICARE as an insurance holder. This is a big problem because most doctors accept TRICARE. Thank you, Obama. The economy stinks and people are loosing jobs left and right. Fact, companies aren't willing to hire because they don't have the sufficient funds to pay their employees. Our Government's failing the people of America.

This post has been edited by techie4fun: 08 July 2011 - 07:35 PM

[coastie65]

mjd420nova, on 08 July 2011 - 10:11 AM, said:

I didn't even want to get started on the UNION problem. It used to be that the unions provided all the health and welfare benefits. Then they (the unions) got greedy and started hiring and paying for representatives and stewards that did nothing but provide oversight that undermined the companies way to do their business. The unions ruined the "teamwork" aspect of working for any employer. Heaven forbid you would help another worker do part of his job. This was seen as job security. The companies are having their feet held to the flames to follow union guidelines that do nothing but slow down production and create animosity between workers. Companies have now burned their employees by cutting back on the amount they pay for health care, putting a bigger burden on the workers to pay the increasing costs from their own pockets and then being forced by their emplyers to do more work for less pay while they layoff more and more workers. Older workers are being forced out by managements by any method they can come up with. Once out of the work force and unemployed, employers are looking to hire unskilled workers for less pay. This results in the service industry being ripe with idiot workers who don't know their jobs and the customer gets no support. Many repair services, be it computers to washing machines, charge so much money for labor costs and material markups that it is cheaper to buy a new whatever and throw the old one away. This might be good for industries that manufacture those products but places a real strain on landfills. Recycling helps to relieve some of that problem but then they force you to pay for them to pickup those items that they collect more money for when routed to those parts of the recycle market. When will it end?? Will Washington ever see the light and begin to do the nations business and stop filling their pockets at the cost of the citizens. And they call that PUBLIC SERVICE??

Although here, some do take their old Refridgerators , Freezers, and A/Cs to the landfill, they won't accept them with the compressors still attached. For the most part they are usually recycled for the metal in them and not just dumped to rust away over time. At the turn of the 20th Century, there were sweat shops and the working conditions were deploreable. The Unions were instrumental in the changes that took place, but they have outlived their usefulness. Where it used to be that the uniins in fact did pay the retirement and Healthcare benefits, but now it has been shifted to the employer, and in a lot of cases at no expense to the employee. In the public sector, some of the cost is being shifted back to the employee to some degree. I find it ridiculous that some public service employees retire making $50,000 per year and in retirement end up with 100k + and in most cases haven't contributed a dime. No wonder states and localities are going broke. It is unsustainable, plain and simple. I have always contributed something to my Retirement and Healthcare plans. At present, I do have Medicare ( I pay a monthly premium ) and I also have a supplemental policy ( an addtional monthly premium ). I get my healthcare through the VA, which costs me nothing due to my classification. Why purchase insurance ? Simple, sometimes you will get diverted by the VA to another Hospital for whatever reason. Any procedure outside of the ER, needs to be Okayed first by the VA, otherwise, they won't get paid ( at least by the VA ). Point is, People need to take personal responsibility for themselves.

Virginia is one of only two states that have outlawed collective bargaining by Public Service employees ( North Carolina is the other ). This has been in effect since the 40's here. After all, these people are public servants and paid by the taxpayer. The point is, if people would get their heads out of the sand, they would see that the Unions, with their incessant and unrealistic demands, are sucking the life out of the economy ( not to mention all the Lawyers out there with their lawsuits that you, the consumer end up paying for in the form of higher prices ). Yep, changes are needed alright, in the form of a National Right to work Law as well as Tort reform.

[lilxkid24]

mjd420nova, on 07 July 2011 - 05:26 PM, said:

What's wrong with Obama? Why is he afraid to just come out and say it. The U.S. could eliminate our trade imbalance in just one year if we would all just stop buying overseas products and buy AMERICAN. Who cares about NAFTA, lets turn the tables on the whole thing and stop buying products made outside the U.S. and buy our own goods. We could make the country the once proud and sought after producer of quality goods and services. The final step would be to get rid of federal income tax and institute a national sales tax. No more tax cheats or loop holes for the rich to jump through. No one would care how much you made, but if you spend it, you will pay your share. Corporations would also be subject to these taxes when they buy the components from which they build their products. The IRS could be then put to work accounting for all the money that comes in and stop chasing those who think they can side step the laws with hiding their profits and moving their operations off-shore. When the politicians begin listening to their constituents and doing the the countries business instead of lining their pockets with kick backs and bribes to vote for laws and amendments that would benefit only those with the money to buy those politicians. Another can of worms is the death penalty. How do you stop criminals when you have no way to eliminate the repeat offenders and just keep them in jail 'til they die. This country spends more money keeping crooks in jail than we do on educating our children - - that's the real crime and it only perpetuates itself. Does your vote make a difference who gets elected?? So much is wrong with our country, illegal immigrants pour across our borders to get free medical care and schooling for their kids while the real citizens can't get the care they need. We want to be compassionate but must it be at the cost of our own economy and well being.

Lol that is like what my poly sci professor basically said and he is like a hardcore conservative

[waldojim]

mjd420nova, on 07 July 2011 - 05:26 PM, said:

What's wrong with Obama? Why is he afraid to just come out and say it. The U.S. could eliminate our trade imbalance in just one year if we would all just stop buying overseas products and buy AMERICAN. Who cares about NAFTA, lets turn the tables on the whole thing and stop buying products made outside the U.S. and buy our own goods. We could make the country the once proud and sought after producer of quality goods and services.

Not trying to cut you off there, but this is the only part I really wanted to reply to.

First: What products would you like us to purchase that are truly made in the US?
Cars? There are none. Not any more. My Mitsubishi was assembled here, nothing more. Many 'domestic' cars aren't even assembled here.
PCs? Again, they don't exist.
TV's? Nope, none of them either.
Ink Pen? I think there might be one or two expensive pens left.
Watch? Nope... the cheap ones are china, the best ones from all over Europe. I don't think I have seen a quality US watch.

Ignoring the actual products available in the US, let me ask you the even more important questions.

Where is the quality? The last few US made products I have seen, were built with quality directly comparable to their Chinese counterparts, and cost considerably more. Is it too much to ask for US products to actually be WORTH what they are asking for them?

Lastly - the cost is also directly related to what they have to spend to make them. We need people to understand that they cannot make $30/hr to check a gauge, write down a number, and move on. I actually know someone who worked at a factory doing just that. She checked gauges, and ensured they were in the green. That was all. She wouldn't even conduct repairs if they weren't. She just wrote it down, and moved on. For that, she was paid about $35 every hour. A trained monkey could do that for a banana. Get the labor cost down, and you will see comparable pricing, and you may even be able to get companies to focus on quality again.

[waldojim]

LiveBrianD, on 07 July 2011 - 07:45 PM, said:

And I might as well not even mention healthcare for everybody - something that practically EVERY developed nation out there EXCEPT the united states has.

Have you seen the complaints that go with that?
MONTHS waiting on an MRI.
MONTHS waiting on specialized care.
SUBstandard care.
The list goes on.
No, I don't want that crap.

Quote

Also, if there was a high import tax, companies would have less reason to have everything made in China. The problem is that the profit motive is sometimes too much - why use drilling practices that are definitely safe (or, for that matter, even drill at all) when you can use ones that might fail and create a huge spill but save you a bunch of money in the short run?

Who cares about the companies? TAX the crap out of ALL IMPORTS. Let China send crap here, and make sure the US profits from it.

[nonseq]

I may not have much to offer but here goes. I have become convinced that trade is at the very heart of our economic woes. The focus on producing goods for trade first is gutting local resources and impoverishing those who have rich natural resources available except that they do not have ownership.

Wouldn't it be better to develop local economies that meet local needs first. instead of producing products to be sold elsewhere we should produce to sell locally and then export only the surplus.

What keeps us from doing so? Free market capitalism is the root of the problem, in my opinion. Communism is just as bad in fact it is just the other side of capitalist coin. We can't consume and produce our way to real prosperity. We can conserve and use resources only as needed to make our communities thrive and sustain themselves.

I recommend the insights of Wendell Berry who states this much better than I.

This post has been edited by coastie65: 14 July 2011 - 10:02 AM

[mjd420nova]

The real beginnings of this problem started many years ago when the right to strike was given to the unions, even though their members wanted to stay on the job. Why the strikes?? To raise the pay for the members and pay those higher and higher dues demanded by the unions. Inflation was rampant because of this. The unions then made it impossible for companies to fire those poor producing workers and the quality went down. The result was that the imports did become direct competitors in quality but not in price. Why?? No unions in those importing countries and the workers were being paid a wage that was good pay for them, in their countries. No wonder the manufacturers flocked over seas to get them to make those products, import them and charge a cheaper price but reap much higher margins meaning bigger profits. It was just good business. And where did this get us?? Right where we are now, sending a majority of our money out of the country to line the pockets of foreign powers who distain us for our human rights programs. Where will it end?? It ends when we have more immigrants in this country than natural citizens and they will become the landlords. The political system is becoming loaded with these people who came here for the free ride and are now directing the future of our economy. It used to be that the major owners of property was the japanese, but that has now shifted to China. Who do we owe the biggest debt to?? China. What will happen when they decide to call in those markers?? The united states will become fractured. And those states who seek to protect themselves and their citizens will have their feet held to the fire for trying to insure they remain safe. Arizona has the right idea. They are trying to do the things that the federal government either can't or won't do. And when did the cities decide that they would become havens for illegal aliens by not reporting their status and either deporting them or force them to become real citizens and begin contributing to the economy and not suck it dry. Call me an isolationist but it's time we started looking after our own people, stop giving away money to other countries who will take the cash and turn their backs on what we want in return. Enough said.

[coastie65]

FACT: This Government gave millions of dollars to a company in Massachusetts to develope wind turbines and create jobs. They did............in China, as they offshored the manufacturing. Goes to show you the level of the nitwits we have running this country. As I said, we develope and export the technology so someone else can make and export the products back to us.