[waldojim]

Click here for screen shots!

Ok, I decided to check it out, and see what I thought about Windows 8. I also decided to put it through its paces on a complicated machine: the Lenovo W520. Remember guys, Windows 7 DOES NOT run correctly in UEFI mode. Windows 7 has a stroke the moment a video driver is installed.

SOMETHING HAS CHANGED. I cannot say for certain how much has changed in the underpinning that undoubtedly is Windows 7, but it is clear to me that something has changed for the better. Windows 8 Developer is running 100% compatible (so far!) with UEFI. I do not have everything installed yet. Windows also reports a completely different OS, making installation of some drivers... difficult. But I have the core functionality working at 100%.

I am using a 'spare' 160GB 5400rpm hard drive for now. I will say that whatever speed improvements MS was claiming was just that, a claim. SO FAR, this system is POKEY. I cannot see how this can realistically run on a dual core ARM based tablet, forget about a single core machine of any kind. Once started, it seems to run OK. With proper display drivers in place, the visual effects are smooth, but generally boring. MS has made a point of using a LOT of SOLID colors. I honestly feel like I am using Windows 2.0 again. The title bars have a Fisher Price feel to them. Being without an applications menu is killing me! It also took a LONG time to figure out how to shut the machine down.

I may put up more photos as I go, and will update the links as needed.

I will also do a bit of benchmarking to see what sort of difference there is at the moment.

Realize, as I do, that this is not a final version. This is just a quick look at things to come. There seems to be a bit of work under the hood already in Windows 8 as well as on the surface. I am guessing that a lot had to change to make this work out well.

Any ideas, things you explicitly want me to explore? Anything you just HAVE to know about? Being a developer preview, I doubt many will try to run this as a primary OS for any length, and I wouldn't expect most sane people to do that. So I am willing to give you guys exactly what you want.

[waldojim]

Ok then... WIE is all over the place.

Processor, 7.2
Ram, 7.8
Graphics, 5.3
Gaming graphics, 6.3
Hard disk, 5.2

---
The hard drive I understand.

---
3dmark Vantage refuses to run.
"std::exception
FullscreenState lost"

This post has been edited by waldojim: 15 September 2011 - 01:35 AM

[waldojim]

Ok, in my attempt to get 3dmark / furmark / etc working, I managed one heck of a driver fiasco. Eventually leading to a wicked problem I never expected. Windows acting like Linux! Specifically when you give Linux bad video modes to work in, it will sit there for a good 5 minutes or more trying to find a way to sync up to a monitor before giving up. Windows did the same. Windows repair functions have changed a lot. No more goofy text menu when you hit F8 during boot. A nice clean graphical menu. No screenies, sorry, but without a virtual machine, that was impossible.

----
edit
----

Touchpad gestures do work, but I have found they are of limited value. The most important ones I would care about, are the navigate left and right (due to the Metro interface). Rather than slide the entire screen, it simply moves ONE icon left or right.

This post has been edited by waldojim: 15 September 2011 - 03:23 AM

[compnovo]

Hey wj,
Thanks for the posts, it's good to see someone's real life experience with the build. At the moment my interest is POSSIBLY an Asus Transformer running Win8, where I could really take advantage of switching between the tiled GUI and the more traditional one. I know Asus has a Win8 version planned but I haven't heard whether it will be running an ARM or an Intel proc.

[coastie65]

waldojim, on 15 September 2011 - 03:08 AM, said:

Ok, in my attempt to get 3dmark / furmark / etc working, I managed one heck of a driver fiasco. Eventually leading to a wicked problem I never expected. Windows acting like Linux! Specifically when you give Linux bad video modes to work in, it will sit there for a good 5 minutes or more trying to find a way to sync up to a monitor before giving up. Windows did the same. Windows repair functions have changed a lot. No more goofy text menu when you hit F8 during boot. A nice clean graphical menu. No screenies, sorry, but without a virtual machine, that was impossible.

I haven't had any problem running that. It will start then a Window will open saying that it has stopped. I will close that window and it will continue and run, starting with Ms. Nash ( love watching her ). I am assuming though you are talking about running it in a Windows 8 Beta of some sort? I am running it in Windows 7.

[waldojim]

compnovo, on 15 September 2011 - 06:29 AM, said:

Hey wj,
Thanks for the posts, it's good to see someone's real life experience with the build. At the moment my interest is POSSIBLY an Asus Transformer running Win8, where I could really take advantage of switching between the tiled GUI and the more traditional one. I know Asus has a Win8 version planned but I haven't heard whether it will be running an ARM or an Intel proc.

No problem at all! I get tired of reading articles from most of the major publishers, as they are rarely balanced, and don't hit on real world usability at all. So I figure getting a running test bed that can be stressed a bit, and put through my personal tests will show me far more of what a person can really expect.

I don't know what ARM processor Asus will be using, and I certainly don't know if Windows 8 will start in more of a 'stripped' mode (cannot think of a better way to phrase it) for tablets, but right now, with only IE open, I am sitting at 558 threads over 38 processes running! I don't know how usable this would really be on a tablet.

One other interesting factor worth mentioning though, Remote desktop seems to be a BIG push now. It looks like MS really WANTS you to remote into a home PC if your mobile devices isn't up to par. Haven't played with it yet, but I will take the time later to see if there were any real changes to it.

[waldojim]

coastie65, on 15 September 2011 - 09:25 AM, said:

I haven't had any problem running that. It will start then a Window will open saying that it has stopped. I will close that window and it will continue and run, starting with Ms. Nash ( love watching her ). I am assuming though you are talking about running it in a Windows 8 Beta of some sort? I am running it in Windows 7.

In Windows 7 it works great. In Windows 8... not so much. So far it would seem that full screen apps (mobile style apps) work great, and full screen applications (windows native) are relatively broken. Not sure if it is just full screen applications, or full screen 3d applications yet. I will try to narrow down failure points as I go.

So far, I must admit, the system is more responsive than I expected. This is probably a result of moving to very simple animations, and simple, solid colors.

[coastie65]

waldojim, on 15 September 2011 - 11:20 AM, said:

coastie65, on 15 September 2011 - 09:25 AM, said:

I haven't had any problem running that. It will start then a Window will open saying that it has stopped. I will close that window and it will continue and run, starting with Ms. Nash ( love watching her ). I am assuming though you are talking about running it in a Windows 8 Beta of some sort? I am running it in Windows 7.

In Windows 7 it works great. In Windows 8... not so much. So far it would seem that full screen apps (mobile style apps) work great, and full screen applications (windows native) are relatively broken. Not sure if it is just full screen applications, or full screen 3d applications yet. I will try to narrow down failure points as I go.

So far, I must admit, the system is more responsive than I expected. This is probably a result of moving to very simple animations, and simple, solid colors.

Keep in mind that Windows 8 is a Work in Progress, so there are going to be issues for awhile.

[waldojim]

coastie65, on 15 September 2011 - 11:46 AM, said:

Keep in mind that Windows 8 is a Work in Progress, so there are going to be issues for awhile.

No delusions here, I very much understand. Some things appear to be design decisions though, and other seems like build issues. I will try to be more clear as I post information on it.

[LiveBrianD]

I had no issues loading the ati driver on my laptop. (which is now reverted back to w7)

In w7, I like aero, but I turned off the fading animations and such. I do NOT like the login screen now at all - the green color is ugly. Seriously, idk, but I'd really like an option to disable metro. A lack of one is a total dealbreaker. It was perfectly smooth on the netbook. (btw it automatically used the native 1366x768 res with aero, probably because the hardware is now older than the OS running on it)

Waldojim, I get a 'not found' error when I click on your thumbnails. I clicked download and got "Error: Tell your friend to turn their PC back on!". Huh?

This post has been edited by LiveBrianD: 15 September 2011 - 04:04 PM

[waldojim]

LiveBrianD, on 15 September 2011 - 04:03 PM, said:

I had no issues loading the ati driver on my laptop. (which is now reverted back to w7)

In w7, I like aero, but I turned off the fading animations and such. I do NOT like the login screen now at all - the green color is ugly. Seriously, idk, but I'd really like an option to disable metro. A lack of one is a total dealbreaker. It was perfectly smooth on the netbook. (btw it automatically used the native 1366x768 res with aero, probably because the hardware is now older than the OS running on it)

Waldojim, I get a 'not found' error when I click on your thumbnails. I clicked download and got "Error: Tell your friend to turn their PC back on!". Huh?

ROFL! The media center must have updated again... when Windows updates, that machine tends to be retarded, and not restart. It is back online now.

[LiveBrianD]

Why are the files linked to your own machine anyway?

Apparently w8 does NOT like vmware - I get a odd execution error from vmware before setup even starts. Virtualbox seems to work fine. Dang... installed in about 20 minutes... quick!

This post has been edited by LiveBrianD: 15 September 2011 - 04:28 PM

[waldojim]

LiveBrianD, on 15 September 2011 - 04:18 PM, said:

Why are the files linked to your own machine anyway?

Apparently w8 does NOT like vmware - I get a odd execution error from vmware before setup even starts. Virtualbox seems to work fine. Dang... installed in about 20 minutes... quick!

That choice has many reasons. First, I can control access to my content at any time. I can put out limited one-time use emails for my content. Most importantly though, I retain ALL rights to my content. Using Imageshack, photobucket, etc means they have the rights to use them as they see fit. I refuse. This also provides me a central point that works with ALL of my mobile devices. I don't have to deal with advertising, or possibly poisoned links. There are many reasons, and I suggest everyone with those means do the same.

edit: VM installation was fast, but the real life install is about an hour...

This post has been edited by waldojim: 15 September 2011 - 04:37 PM

[LiveBrianD]

Wow... I told it to launch 'Notespace' from the start screen and a whole minute later I'm STILL just staring at a blank green screen with the hard drive working away. I bet Vista (no service packs) on a Pentium 3 would fare better. MUCH better. Seriously, if it's going to hog 30% of the hosts's quad-core CPU, it had better at least load in a decent amount of time.

How much do those sites actually reuse your content? Do they have any reason to reuse screenshots of things?

Amazing... it gave me a code 37 error with the graphics driver, staying with the generic one. When I tried to manually install the inf in device manager, it BSOD'd. The second time, it stayed with code 37. It's not obvious how to run a admin command prompt. There's no search tool for that! I had to go into system32 and run cmd.exe as an admin there. Lame...

https://skydrive.liv...11968&sc=photos
Some pics

This post has been edited by LiveBrianD: 15 September 2011 - 05:30 PM

[waldojim]

LiveBrianD, on 15 September 2011 - 04:44 PM, said:

Wow... I told it to launch 'Notespace' from the start screen and a whole minute later I'm STILL just staring at a blank green screen with the hard drive working away. I bet Vista (no service packs) on a Pentium 3 would fare better. MUCH better. Seriously, if it's going to hog 30% of the hosts's quad-core CPU, it had better at least load in a decent amount of time.

I want to know how this is supposed to be viable on a tablet. The OS seems FAR too bulky to be used on tablets. Not to mention how badly it would rape a smartphone.

Quote

How much do those sites actually reuse your content? Do they have any reason to reuse screenshots of things?

The question isn't how much do they do it, the question is what rights do they have to it.

Quote

Amazing... it gave me a code 37 error with the graphics driver, staying with the generic one. When I tried to manually install the inf in device manager, it BSOD'd. The second time, it stayed with code 37. It's not obvious how to run a admin command prompt. There's no search tool for that! I had to go into system32 and run cmd.exe as an admin there. Lame...

The graphics driver has been an interesting problem for me as well. I got my Optimus setup working for a short while, then it went to some goofy blinking thing. Not sure, but there may have been some fairly extensive changes to the windows graphic interface.

[LiveBrianD]

I'm not sure how heavy the ARM version will be. Also, this beta probably isn't optimized. Irritatingly, some assessment or maintenance process keeps hogging 100% of the vm's cpu when I leave it alone. I had it running, left it for 5 minutes, and found the host having 30% cpu usage and the cpu fan spinning up (I can hear it and it gets a bit annoying when it's unnecessary). I shut it down.

Also, I think you're technically making these posts the property of pcworld. Do I care? Not really. It's not like they're tracking me and making online profiles of me. THAT I actively try to block.

In the short period of time it was on my laptop, I had no issues with the video driver. It was totally smooth and perfect. Aero, correct screen res, everything. AMD did a good job there. What do you mean goofy blinking thing? Black screen with a cursor in the top left? Like when you update the driver and it does that for a second? Notice that in that link I posted, I typed 'ver' in cmd and got Windows 6.2.8102.

This post has been edited by LiveBrianD: 15 September 2011 - 06:26 PM

[waldojim]

LiveBrianD, on 15 September 2011 - 05:43 PM, said:

I'm not sure how heavy the ARM version will be. Also, this beta probably isn't optimized. Irritatingly, some assessment or maintenance process keeps hogging 100% of the vm's cpu when I leave it alone. I had it running, left it for 5 minutes, and found the host having 30% cpu usage and the cpu fan spinning up (I can hear it and it gets a bit annoying when it's unnecessary). I shut it down.

My copy has been asking permission to do that.

On a side note, I have found that it idles to around 1.2% cpu usage with the CPU clocked down to under 1Ghz! Windows 8 certainly knows how to tell processes to STOP RUNNING as needed. I can deal with that.

Quote

Also, I think you're technically making these posts the property of pcworld. Do I care? Not really. It's not like they're tracking me and making online profiles of me. THAT I actively try to block.

Posts, yes. IMAGES? No. Video content, or anything else I compile in my own time? No. PC World does not have the right to claim my content that I link to.

Quote

In the short period of time it was on my laptop, I had no issues with the video driver. It was totally smooth and perfect. Aero, correct screen res, everything. AMD did a good job there. What do you mean goofy blinking thing? Black screen with a cursor in the top left? Like when you update the driver and it does that for a second? Notice that in that link I posted, I typed 'ver' in cmd and got Windows 6.2.8102.

I will get a video if I can force it to break again... though honestly, I would rather not. It was a PITA to fix. The easy way to explain it is this: The entire lock screen loads, then dies to a black screen for about 1/2 second. Then loads again for about 1 second and repeats.

[LiveBrianD]

My machine idles at about 3%, WITH a few sidebar gadgets (network, weather, cpu, gpu). Without, probably about 0-1%.

Could it be something with nvidia drivers that w8 doesn't like? Odd, but hey, it is a beta.

[waldojim]

LiveBrianD, on 15 September 2011 - 08:07 PM, said:

My machine idles at about 3%, WITH a few sidebar gadgets (network, weather, cpu, gpu). Without, probably about 0-1%.

Could it be something with nvidia drivers that w8 doesn't like? Odd, but hey, it is a beta.

Not sure yet. I will lock down the video card to NVidia only to test.

[waldojim]

OK, after locking down the NVidia only, it appears that Windows default drivers are the problem. I have no proof yet, but I am working on it. The machine starts fine, though at 640x480. After about 5 minutes or so, the display resolution suddenly changed to native 1080P, and was hard locked. Wouldn't run at all after that. Trying to force in NVidia drivers, and will see how that goes.