[RickHan]

Most phone users aren't smartphone users, so the market is wide open.
If you like to tinker, are technically oriented, and don't need an ecosystem, then Android is fine.
Otherwise its Apple.
Also, developing for Android is a nightmare. Which phone and OS version does your app support? And for users, will your phone company ever upgrade your phone to a current version?
That said, I switched to Windows Phone 7. Very easy to develop for. One OS version to support, with all phones getting a free upgrade over a short period of time. And an ecosystem that rivals Apples'. Predictions are that for end of 2012 early 2013, WP7 will overtake iPhone as #2, and will make great inroads on Android. Not from people switching as much as new users to smartphones, as the interface is much easier to use than Android, and a bit easier the than Apple's.

[crosswordbob]

fatkat, on 07 November 2011 - 12:25 PM, said:

For me the biggest reason that iPhone users get iPhones is the reinforced sense of inflated self worth that comes with getting an Apple product. You see these surveys in which Apple computer users or iPhone owners explain how they "know" that they are more intelligent than people who do not buy Apple.

Actually, going by the list of "reasons" quoted in the article, it is those Android users that subscribe to these beliefs (and not all do) that have an inflated sense of self worth. I don't believe that owning an Apple product means that I am more intelligent than those who do not, but apparently many Android fans believe it means I am less so for the same reason.

I'd be interested to know whether any of the author's readers suggested that iPhone users bought their iPhones because they are decent products that do what they need and do it well. For what it's worth, I'm quite content to believe the same of them and theirs.

[RickHan]

You used to have to compile Linux distributions. Some apps and utilities you still need to compile.
Linux/Unix is good for technical users for some applications..and is cheap/free. However, I can configure 10 complex Windows servers in the time it takes to do one Linux/Unix. And forget about an easy to use consumer interface with lots of good, easy to use apps that play well with what most others are using..

The ultimate question for any general OS is: Would you like to support your mother on it? Or your friends mothers... WP7 wins on this, and so will Windows 8...

[linuxrants7xpg]

RickHan, on 07 November 2011 - 12:50 PM, said:

You used to have to compile Linux distributions. Some apps and utilities you still need to compile.
Linux/Unix is good for technical users for some applications..and is cheap/free. However, I can configure 10 complex Windows servers in the time it takes to do one Linux/Unix. And forget about an easy to use consumer interface with lots of good, easy to use apps that play well with what most others are using..

The ultimate question for any general OS is: Would you like to support your mother on it? Or your friends mothers... WP7 wins on this, and so will Windows 8...

Same bogus crap all the time. None of that is true. It might have been true in the 90s. Maybe.

[MichaelOConnor]

What ever works for you, you should get. For me, I wanted to program my phone, and 1) I already know java 2) don't own a mac (yes you can use an iPhone on a PC, even Linux, but you need Xcode, only avalable for Mac OS X, to program the iOS, also it is obj-c langauge vs java), so the Android was a given, and I wanted a bit more customization on the phone.

[ChadTrautvetter]

I have an iPhone because it works well for me. I don't have to deal with the OS or apps crashing, nor do I have to worry that apps have hidden spyware or malware in them.

If you like Android, I have no problem with that. Use whatever you like -- that's what consumer choice means.

But don't paint me as a snob, Apple fan boy, etc., because you couldn't be more wrong.

I have an iPhone because it works well for me. I don't have to deal with the OS or apps crashing, nor do I have to worry that apps have hidden spyware or malware in them.

If you like Android, I have no problem with that. Use whatever you like -- that's what consumer choice means.

But don't paint me as a snob, Apple fan boy, etc., because you couldn't be more wrong.

[RickHan]

Same bogus crap all the time. None of that is true. It might have been true in the 90s. Maybe.
[/quote]

Ahh, really? It was very true in the '90s, but still true now. I definitely see a use for Linux/Unix servers, especially as Web servers.
As for desktop, only a true geek would use it. Automatic driver and app upgrades? Game support? Social support, ie Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn? Haven't looked recently, but wasn't much there last time I looked. And not many places selling fully configured desktop Linux PCs for consumer use.
And the future is in task oriented UIs, not app oriented, and definitely not command line.
WP 7 and Windows 8 is actually leading in this area, with Android and Apple trying to catch up. I'm actually amazed that Microsoft could do this..

[linuxrants7xpg]

RickHan, on 07 November 2011 - 02:08 PM, said:

Ahh, really? It was very true in the '90s, but still true now.

No, it's not.

RickHan, on 07 November 2011 - 02:08 PM, said:

I definitely see a use for Linux/Unix servers, especially as Web servers. As for desktop, only a true geek would use it.

That might be true, but only because uninformed people keep telling others that it's "too hard" or "a hobbiest's OS".

RickHan, on 07 November 2011 - 02:08 PM, said:

Automatic driver and app upgrades? Game support? Social support, ie Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn? Haven't looked recently, but wasn't much there last time I looked.

It's equivalent to Windows now. The problem here is that you're making statements about a current OS based on "the last time you looked", which obviously wasn't recently.

RickHan, on 07 November 2011 - 02:08 PM, said:

And not many places selling fully configured desktop Linux PCs for consumer use.

Finally, something that's true.

RickHan, on 07 November 2011 - 02:08 PM, said:

And the future is in task oriented UIs, not app oriented, and definitely not command line.
WP 7 and Windows 8 is actually leading in this area, with Android and Apple trying to catch up. I'm actually amazed that Microsoft could do this..

Maybe. We'll see.

[generosity9c1ir]

As others have said, there is *equal* venom coming from the Apple camp!

Many Android users have heard iPhone users tell them that their OS is slow, unpolished, crap, fragmented, ugly, unstable, etc. The picture that you paint in your article is one-sided and false.

This post has been edited by generosity9c1ir: 07 November 2011 - 02:24 PM

[crosswordbob]

generosity9c1ir, on 07 November 2011 - 02:23 PM, said:

As others have said, there is *equal* venom coming from the Apple camp!

Many Android users have heard iPhone users tell them that their OS is slow, unpolished, crap, fragmented, ugly, unstable, etc. The picture that you paint in your article is one-sided and false.

I dont deny it exists, but I would question the claim that it is "equal". For a start, there is a difference between criticizing an OS and criticizing those who choose to use it. I can think of very few Apple users who are as dismissive of Android users as those presented in the article are of Apple users. However, there are, alas, a few, and I am every bit as scathing of them.

[QUADICON]

If you want an objective viewpoint of a device that you could be considering, it is best to ask someone who is tech savvy, not a bias product fanatic.

Bec a fan will only give you the pluses of one, while a tech fan will talk about every possible option that fits, give you an honest comparison, and none will be based on preference.

Fans are like politicians, they will always make their choice the best and the other is automatically bad, even if facts show different.

Reality shows all platforms have their pros and cons. No single platforms may have all your needs, unless you have a small list of needs. For the bare basics, all of them offer a suitable options. For those who need advanced features, some platforms offer some better options.

Again its need. There is nothing wrong with sticking to a brand that works for you. There is something wrong with sticking to a brand when you know other better options exist, but you wont switch for invalid reasons.

[RickHan]

It's been a few, probably 5 years, since I looked at Linux desktop.
Even less of a demand now for it.
No one is putting enough money behind it to make it a commercial success.
And lots of the most popular apps and games won't work on Linux/Unix. (WoW version for Linux??????)
Unfortunately Linux is competing against WP7/Win8 Metro UI and Apple's Siri (usable voice based UI). That's the future, and where the money is.
Microsoft junked the Windows Mobile 6.x UI for WP7's Metro. Win8's default UI will be Metro(Win7 UI optional).
I don't see Android or Linux/Unix heading quickly in a similar or equivalent direction. Android is stuck in the WM6.x on steroids universe and Linux /Unix is in the Windows XP one. Microsoft has abandoned both.
And Microsoft is beefing up it's voice recognition tech to compete with Siri, and Apple is moving more toward task orientation rather than app orientation in the future.

[QUADICON]

linuxrants7xpg, on 07 November 2011 - 12:58 PM, said:

RickHan, on 07 November 2011 - 12:50 PM, said:

You used to have to compile Linux distributions. Some apps and utilities you still need to compile.
Linux/Unix is good for technical users for some applications..and is cheap/free. However, I can configure 10 complex Windows servers in the time it takes to do one Linux/Unix. And forget about an easy to use consumer interface with lots of good, easy to use apps that play well with what most others are using..

The ultimate question for any general OS is: Would you like to support your mother on it? Or your friends mothers... WP7 wins on this, and so will Windows 8...

Same bogus crap all the time. None of that is true. It might have been true in the 90s. Maybe.

Even tho a lot has changed, he still makes a good point. I do have to agree that I too could set up multiple Windows Servers or desktops in the same time I can likely only do a few Linux machines doing the same thing.

However it would depend on a persons knowledge.

However, for a person who has never used Linux or Windows, I did teach a class where on the first day I asked the class to set up a webserver using Linux Red Hat and Windows 2000 Server. Less than 1% of the class got linux up and working, while 90% of the class got a basic web server up and running under Windows. Now grant it, this was back in the 90's.

However, even today Linux is still not as friendly as Windows. It is better tho. But I can still get way more Windows boxes up and running even with a version of Windows I have never used.

For example. Even tho I played with the beta of Windows Server 2008, I didn't set up any web servers or email. When I did, I had a box up and running with a fresh install using mail and web services and even media services in less than 1 hour. Even tho I am more familiar with Linux today than I was back then, it still took me over an hour to accomplish setting up an advanced server where many features I still couldnt implement at all.

[nonseq]

It's my belief that one of the greatest limiting factors, if not the greatest limiting factor, comes from the attitude of technicians and many engineers who, in the final analysis, have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo with incremental improvement instead of paradigm shift. There is sometimes resistance to learning and embracing new technologies or new ways of doing things. Often, from my perspective, this is an ego thing and technicians are unwilling to give up the illusion that the technician knows more about what a user needs than the actual user.

In my opinion, for most who use or will want to use smartphones, the buying decision should be make based not on features or specs but on user preferences for what they want the device to do and by actually trying the interface and usability of the device.

This post has been edited by nonseq: 07 November 2011 - 03:29 PM

[lostartistic]

Its the same on both sides. But what is frustrating for many people is that in order to get this phone you have to pay big time and the product is made for bying more and more of apps. Expensive apps that still can't open a simple .doc file.
So if you agree to a 48 month contract in order to get the phone for a price you can pay, is idiotic.

[lostartistic]

I have a macbook pro. The only computer ive ever had that i clean once in a while. And Ipad. because as a child i wanted one while watching Star Trek.
But i hate these Extreme Apple users that say that Apple is always best and everytime Microsoft comes with a new product, someone says "Apple already has that!"

Having OSX there is [censored] loads of bugs like the USB conflicts. SMB sharing. File sharing. Ntfs ext hdd. Ipad cant read Doc files and realy only can do 0,8% of what i wanted from a tablet.

I love the MacBook Pro because windows was [censored]. Shitty shitty if you hadnt a updated virus and firewalls and etc.Never any fan noise or the feeling of my thies boiling.
And the battery which is a mother fudger on Android and windows.
6 Hours on a 2009 machine!!

BUT

I like Android because, ITS A PHONE!!!

Its not something you should pay that much for. The mp3 or streaming is realy not that different on Android from iOS
Android has a freedom feeling, while Iphone is very restricted. But on Android Google always sees you.

Now i believe there is only that many different Iphones you can make before the whole consept will be history just like the Minidisc that for a period of over 7 years was HUGE and then Mp3 came and it died.

Iphone has been around for almost 5 years?

[RickHan]

nonseq, on 07 November 2011 - 03:28 PM, said:

It's my belief that one of the greatest limiting factors, if not the greatest limiting factor, comes from the attitude of technicians and many engineers who, in the final analysis, have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo with incremental improvement instead of paradigm shift. There is sometimes resistance to learning and embracing new technologies or new ways of doing things. Often, from my perspective, this is an ego thing and technicians are unwilling to give up the illusion that the technician knows more about what a user needs than the actual user.

In my opinion, for most who use or will want to use smartphones, the buying decision should be make based not on features or specs but on user preferences for what they want the device to do and by actually trying the interface and usability of the device.

I fully agree. Anyone buying a phone now should try Android, iPhone and Windows Phone 7, and see what they like. Unfortunately, in the short term, there are few sales reps who know WP7 and most have a vested interest in iPhone or Android.
That will be changing. Nokia just launched a massive ad campaign for its new WP7 phones, mostly in Europe so far. Microsoft is starting to launch WP7 ads in the US. The Olympics will be saturated with Nokia/WP7, where Nokia and Microsoft have a much better reputation. The real launch of WP7 is now, what we've seen so far over the last year is a light preview..
Never mind all the other OEMs with new WP7 phones that will be available real soon now...
Lots of good competition on all sides, with a wide open market to win.

[linuxrants7xpg]

RickHan, on 07 November 2011 - 02:44 PM, said:

It's been a few, probably 5 years, since I looked at Linux desktop.
Even less of a demand now for it.

5 years in Linux time is like a century. You're nowhere near current. And there's more demand for Linux now than there was 5 years ago.

RickHan, on 07 November 2011 - 02:44 PM, said:

No one is putting enough money behind it to make it a commercial success.

Except for tiny little companies like IBM, RedHat, and even Microsoft. Billions a year.

RickHan, on 07 November 2011 - 02:44 PM, said:

And lots of the most popular apps and games won't work on Linux/Unix. (WoW version for Linux??????)

Again, you're not up to date.

http://youtu.be/c8VWCFYqJrA

Not native, given, but who really cares?

RickHan, on 07 November 2011 - 02:44 PM, said:

Unfortunately Linux is competing against WP7/Win8 Metro UI and Apple's Siri (usable voice based UI). That's the future, and where the money is.
Microsoft junked the Windows Mobile 6.x UI for WP7's Metro. Win8's default UI will be Metro(Win7 UI optional).
I don't see Android or Linux/Unix heading quickly in a similar or equivalent direction. Android is stuck in the WM6.x on steroids universe and Linux /Unix is in the Windows XP one. Microsoft has abandoned both.
And Microsoft is beefing up it's voice recognition tech to compete with Siri, and Apple is moving more toward task orientation rather than app orientation in the future.

First of all, Metro is ugly. Seriously ugly. While it's got some decent and interesting functionality, there's very little that isn't already matched or surpassed by Android. In my opinion, Siri is a gimmick. It took Dexetra 8 hours to get a fairly close approximation of Siri on Android (Iris). These technologies may be where the industry is going, but they're nothing that Android can't match and then some. Sorry, if that's the best that Android has to compete with, the future is going to be all Android.

[Cruc]

Let them waste their money on pretty things. It keeps the economy going. End of discussion.

[Nuke61]

linuxrants7xpg, on 07 November 2011 - 04:41 PM, said:

In my opinion, Siri is a gimmick. It took Dexetra 8 hours to get a fairly close approximation of Siri on Android (Iris).

Iris is a cool liittle project for 8 hours of work, but it's nowhere near Siri. Go to YouTube and search on 67B1A5jGUhA for a Siri/Iris comparison. It's always the last bits of polishing that take the most amount of time.