[PCWorld]

Post your comments for Why Apple's eBook Pricing Defense Is Wrong here

[rkinne01]

Out of curiousity....

Why not bypass the publisher and sell your book directly to Apple, Amazon, Nook, or Sony? I'd tend to think you'd get more than the 10-15 percent the published would give you.

[FalKirk]

rkinne01, on 16 April 2012 - 10:53 AM, said:

Out of curiousity....

Why not bypass the publisher and sell your book directly to Apple, Amazon, Nook, or Sony? I'd tend to think you'd get more than the 10-15 percent the published would give you.

You can do that today and many do. However, it hasn't proven to be a huge success.

Giving advances, culling stories, editing, marketing and promoting books is probably more important than is often acknowledged.

[FalKirk]

"Amazon’s Kindle pricing was only a “monopoly” because Amazon had the courage and integrity to try and set ebook pricing at a point that was both profitable for the publisher, and more reasonable for the reader."

Whoa, whoa, whoa! Amazon, as you've noted yourself, was selling the ebooks at a loss. They were also distributing them on their then-for-profit ($350-$450) kindles. This is not "integrity". This is trying to lock out the rest of the competition. And once the bookstores and the other distributions channels collapsed, Amazon would be able to dictate the cost that they would buy books from the publishers.

I'm not saying that there is or is not anything wrong with this. It may be illegal or it may be a brilliant business tactic. But it's got nothing to do with integrity and it's got nothing to do with what's right or wrong for the public. It has all to do with Amazon. And that's perfectly okay. But let's acknowledge it for what it is.

[justchris2010]

I had to get my son a school book this year and in E-book form it was the same price as the hard back over $200. The hard back I could see being that price with paper binding the book shipping the heavy books all over the USA But a E-book has none of these things to push the price up. Apple and the publishers are just greedy bastards asking the same price for a non physical item as they do for the physical item and that is just BS.

[justchris2010]

I will just keep torrenting books tell someone gets a clue and realize non physical items you can download don't take all the resources to make so should be a heck of a lot cheaper.

[PCCoder]

justchris2010, on 16 April 2012 - 11:44 AM, said:

I will just keep torrenting books tell someone gets a clue and realize non physical items you can download don't take all the resources to make so should be a heck of a lot cheaper.

I bet a lot of people agree with this. The publishers are trying the same BS that music and movies tried, but ignoring what actually worked, netflix. Reasonable price and low hassle to access.

[nonseq]

justchris2010, on 16 April 2012 - 11:44 AM, said:

I will just keep torrenting books tell someone gets a clue and realize non physical items you can download don't take all the resources to make so should be a heck of a lot cheaper.

So, you view the products of creative efforts to be little more than tangible objects? You don't value the writer's / artist's contribution? I agree that e-books should be cheaper but the author's and creatives who put books together should be well compensated for their contributions.

The Agency Model should appeal to the free-marketeers among us as demand should ultimately set price. Under the Agency Model, Apple does not set prices at all. That decision is made by the publishers and ultimately confirmed or denied by the consumer.

[mikedmiked]

Isn't this the same as saying I don't agree with car prices so I am going to steal cars until they make a car price you like?

PCCoder, on 16 April 2012 - 11:59 AM, said:

justchris2010, on 16 April 2012 - 11:44 AM, said:

I will just keep torrenting books tell someone gets a clue and realize non physical items you can download don't take all the resources to make so should be a heck of a lot cheaper.

I bet a lot of people agree with this. The publishers are trying the same BS that music and movies tried, but ignoring what actually worked, netflix. Reasonable price and low hassle to access.

[PCCoder]

mikedmiked, on 16 April 2012 - 12:12 PM, said:

Isn't this the same as saying I don't agree with car prices so I am going to steal cars until they make a car price you like?

PCCoder, on 16 April 2012 - 11:59 AM, said:

justchris2010, on 16 April 2012 - 11:44 AM, said:

I will just keep torrenting books tell someone gets a clue and realize non physical items you can download don't take all the resources to make so should be a heck of a lot cheaper.

I bet a lot of people agree with this. The publishers are trying the same BS that music and movies tried, but ignoring what actually worked, netflix. Reasonable price and low hassle to access.

Steal a car and leave it to be sold to another person, how is that possible?

[QUADICON]

Funny how you said nearly the same thing I said in one of your partners article when this news broke.

They incur ONE cost. The cost it takes to have peopel type the book and save it to a computer, which likely is already done by the writer and all the publisher has to do is re-edit the orginal work.

After that they have one master file that someone can st at a PC and mak millions of copies in very little time. As you said and I said, no paper, no printing, no shipping, no cost.

So why should I pay book pricing based on that?

What Apple did was find a way to make their platform more popular and get the pubs to agree to a low cost to help drive the platform. Whther you like it or not, it is a form of price fixing.

Apple demanded that the pubs sell the books for the lowest cost that was equal to Amazon. Suppose ethat pub wanted to sell the book higher? OR maybe lower?

Telling me to sell my book at a price I dont want to is price fixing. What else you going to call it Tony?

This would be equal too this. Microsoft goes and tells all the PC OEM"s...Acer sells the lowest price PC on the market. For all you other OEM's, for you to sell Windows on your hardware, any PC you sell that is similar to what Acer sells, must be equal in price. Is that nto price fixing? Suppose the Feds told Apple, they ahve to sell the Mac for the exact same cost as any other PC sporting the same hardware. Do you think Apple would want too? So how dare they demand someone else do it. And you don't see that as price fixing?

Maybe we shoudl demand car companies sell cars and trucks in the same class that have similar features to sell them and match the Kia or Hyundai. Would that not be price fixing? Woudl you like more example?

[dreamerof]

Amazon's pricing strategy was all about Amazon period and not the consumer, author or publisher.

[AdamC]

It is not that Amazon is courageous but a mean to an end namely to ensure that they are the top of the food chain and to sell the kindles. They don't do it out of the goodness of their heart neither did they do it because they are promoting ebook. They are doing it to make money by selling the other products which they are also retailing and you know what they are.

And with loss leaders like ebooks which it a proven tactic use by retailers to lure the shoppers to their shop.

It has nothing to do with courage but a business decision of a mean to an end.

It is only right to call a spade a spade.

[Aeromot]

My question: Do ebooks make publishers obsolete?

In the paper-book world, you need a publisher to edit, design, format, print, distribute, and market the book. The publisher takes a risk with its investment in preparation, paper, ink, storage, shipping and promotion.

Except possibly for promotion, none of those functions are needed in the ebook universe. An author can hire an editor and do the formatting and distribution. The whole process of creating and getting a physical book to market no longer exists, and that was the publisher's primary role. It required big money and accepting the real risk that the book would bomb.

The only possible function a publishing firm has in the ebook sphere is promotion/marketing? Does that happen? I assume it does in some form, but the only promotion I see is direct email from authors, if I have subscribed via their own sites. I might see something pushing an ebook on Amazon, and perhaps the publishers pay for that, though the authors could just as easily arrange that by giving Amazon a larger cut of the price.

So it annoys me that publishers still expect me to pay them a hefty cut for nothing that I can perceive. Having been in the magazine business, I know these are scary, difficult times, but at some point, you have to face the fact that your business model no longer exists and it's time to get out of the way.

And, at least with me, the publishers ARE in the way. I refuse to pay close to(or in a few cases, more than) the price of paper book for an ebook. And I'm unwilling to buy the paper book because I don't want the clutter or to support a business that apparently has no reservations about gouging me. So I'm not buying many books right now.

All of this is a long-winded way of asking the same question rkinne01 did at the beginning of these comments: Why aren't major authors beginning to abandon publishers as ebooks become the majority of sales? Is it because of contractual obligations? Are paper book profits too big to give up yet? Do publishers still provide some necessary function?

I wish they'd just get over it, because there is quite a list of books I want to read digitally, when the price is right.

[mikedmiked]

I am not sure what you are saying. I made the point the the person was stealing books because they didn't like how the books were priced. My response was that based on what they are saying, they think it would be ok to steal a car because they didn't like the price.

PCCoder, on 16 April 2012 - 01:06 PM, said:

mikedmiked, on 16 April 2012 - 12:12 PM, said:

Isn't this the same as saying I don't agree with car prices so I am going to steal cars until they make a car price you like?

PCCoder, on 16 April 2012 - 11:59 AM, said:

justchris2010, on 16 April 2012 - 11:44 AM, said:

I will just keep torrenting books tell someone gets a clue and realize non physical items you can download don't take all the resources to make so should be a heck of a lot cheaper.

I bet a lot of people agree with this. The publishers are trying the same BS that music and movies tried, but ignoring what actually worked, netflix. Reasonable price and low hassle to access.

Steal a car and leave it to be sold to another person, how is that possible?

[xyberviri]

A Ebook is a file, you type copy A B and now you have 2. where exactly is the cost overhead with EBooks, If you install Adobe you can print it to PDF.

Why are Ebooks closer to 90% of the physical price.

Allot of that price was originally the cost of the paper and ink to print that book but with ebooks thats not the case so why are they so expensive.

Ebooks should be 99c

[nonseq]

xyberviri, on 17 April 2012 - 06:32 AM, said:

A Ebook is a file, you type copy A B and now you have 2. where exactly is the cost overhead with EBooks, If you install Adobe you can print it to PDF.

Why are Ebooks closer to 90% of the physical price.

Allot of that price was originally the cost of the paper and ink to print that book but with ebooks thats not the case so why are they so expensive.

Ebooks should be 99c

So, in your opinion, the IP is worth little or nothing? Design, layout, and production of the book should be free? The author should provide the creative effort for free?

I have been buying e-books for a number of years now and only in special circumstances do I buy the physical copy. Are you suggesting that my purchase should not compensate the author, creative folks, and production staff?

What then is the incentive to create content?

This post has been edited by nonseq: 17 April 2012 - 07:12 AM

[PCCoder]

mikedmiked, on 17 April 2012 - 04:38 AM, said:

I am not sure what you are saying. I made the point the the person was stealing books because they didn't like how the books were priced. My response was that based on what they are saying, they think it would be ok to steal a car because they didn't like the price.

PCCoder, on 16 April 2012 - 01:06 PM, said:

mikedmiked, on 16 April 2012 - 12:12 PM, said:

Isn't this the same as saying I don't agree with car prices so I am going to steal cars until they make a car price you like?

PCCoder, on 16 April 2012 - 11:59 AM, said:

justchris2010, on 16 April 2012 - 11:44 AM, said:

I will just keep torrenting books tell someone gets a clue and realize non physical items you can download don't take all the resources to make so should be a heck of a lot cheaper.

I bet a lot of people agree with this. The publishers are trying the same BS that music and movies tried, but ignoring what actually worked, netflix. Reasonable price and low hassle to access.

Steal a car and leave it to be sold to another person, how is that possible?

Somehow you think that torrenting books is the same as stealing a car, so if in your opinion it is the same, how do you steal a car and still leave it there to be sold again in the exact same condition?

[nonseq]

PCCoder, on 17 April 2012 - 07:22 AM, said:

Somehow you think that torrenting books is the same as stealing a car, so if in your opinion it is the same, how do you steal a car and still leave it there to be sold again in the exact same condition?

I think it's the concept of stealing. The car is tangible and can only be stolen once. The value of E-books, music, and movies is found in the intangible- the intellectual and creative property and it can be pirated or stolen multiple times- denying the creators their just due but it's still stealing and made worse by the fact that torrent sites allow the creators to be denied compensation over and over again. Intangible assets are just as real under the law as tangible assets and can be stolen. Stealing is stealing.

To argue that the intangible nature of IP makes it OK to steal (or whatever weasel words folks want to use) is pure sophistry and is a sad commentary on the integrity of the one making the claim.

This post has been edited by nonseq: 17 April 2012 - 09:22 AM

[mikedmiked]

Stealing is stealing. Whether its a book or a car. If you acquire a product that is made for sale and you illegally acquire it, the condition of the product is irrelevant. The fact is with an ebook, the producers including the author, are not getting paid for use of that product. Say what you will about the big publishing companies, but the authors, most of whom make little to no money with their books, are not getting the money they deserve for the purchase of the book as the book was stolen and not purchased.

This post has been edited by mikedmiked: 17 April 2012 - 09:36 AM