[pmodiano]

I bought a Surface RT with the hope that it would fulfill my needs. I am a MS based software developer but my 3-year-old first-gen core I7 laptop burns hotter than a thousand suns and, even with a new battery, lasts an hour at best.

I very much loved the Surface RT (with the tactile keyboard) but returned it today. I really loved it on many levels; I could RDP into my servers; wake up and grab for it to see my email in bed. What killed it for me is that I kept looking every day at the app store and saw a terrible dearth of new apps.

I am a big user of GotoMeeting. I generally spend 3-hours a day using it professionally. I was appalled to discover that despite the fact that a GotoMeeting client is on my Android phone, Windows computer, iPad, iPhone, etc., when I asked in a Citrix forum whether a Windows 8 RT version was in the works, I was told "we are talking about it".

Combined with rumors that Sinofsky, the head of Windows 8 was fired precisely because of the shortage of native Windows 8 apps (the only apps that work on Windows RT), I had no choice, I felt, but to go back to the MS store and return my Surface RT tablet.

I still hold hope for Surface Pro and, frankly, there are so many other fantastic NON RT Windows 8 machines out there, I am not worried about my choices. But I do feel sorry for folks who paid a premium for an RT device, who have let the return date lapse and who watch the "new app" section of the appstore only to find nothing new.

[jazzy007]

Quote

waldojim said

LiveBrianD said
I refuse to support closed platforms, metro gets in the way, and overall, the design is GARBAGE. Now how exactly do I not count? I buy copies of Windows like anyone else, and metro is costing them sales from me. And I DO use my PC for school work (Word, Eclipse). Microsoft making an OS for the few of you that like a poor design isn't going to work wery well in the long run. When you have you resort to personal attacks, you know you don't have much of an argument to stand on. Actually, I didn't. I made a comment that was because you look like a child when you post the same garbage in every thread - when the answer remains the same "DON'T USE IT". You want to stop hearing that answer, come up with a new problem. Metro is not a closed platform. Anyone is free to develop for it. By closed I was referring to the inability to install apps OUTSIDE the app store. Just like the iPhone. (with the exception of web browsers) I refuse to support those platforms on concept - it is not Microsoft's decision to decide whether or not I get to install an app on MY PC. (yes, I know that doesn't apply to the desktop, but they aren't exactly hiding metro, now are they?) Apple seems to be rather nasty in that regard, sometimes blocking apps for competitive reasons, and I don't want any chance of that under Windows 8. (that is part of the reason I don't own any Apple products) And it's a bit hard to ignore metro when they shove it all over the place, hide basic functions (start menu, shutdown, etc),change all the defaults to metro apps (with a different task manager), and have TWO Control Panels (WTF????) that have some overlapping functions, but some not. The fact that I was using the run prompt and CMD to do basic things at first because I couldn't figure out where they hid things says something about how poorly they thought it out. The fact that so far, things are looking negative for them just might have something doing with using the worst design they could think of. Oh and "Not, that you count in the slightest anyways... as someone who doesn't earn a paycheck on their PC anyhow." sounds like a personal attack to me.

LiveBrianD, I understand that you are a college student from your post. First let me suggest to you let the hate go away. If you do not like Windows 8, don't buy it. There are many places where you can buy a computer with Windows 7, or Mac or install Linux. I don't believe your college is making you upgrade to Windows 8. Second, don't click on every article you see about Windows 8. Just skip it and go to the next article, blog, news, etc. I feel your blood preasure is going up. You might have a heart attack. I could see the police investigator say " yes, another death from Windows 8". I am sure your college have a psychiatrists on duty that can help you.

Come back when you are more stress free.

[LiveBrianD]

jazzy007, on 20 November 2012 - 07:31 AM, said:

LiveBrianD, I understand that you are a college student from your post. First let me suggest to you let the hate go away. If you do not like Windows 8, don't buy it. There are many places where you can buy a computer with Windows 7, or Mac or install Linux. I don't believe your college is making you upgrade to Windows 8. Second, don't click on every article you see about Windows 8. Just skip it and go to the next article, blog, news, etc. I feel your blood preasure is going up. You might have a heart attack. I could see the police investigator say " yes, another death from Windows 8". I am sure your college have a psychiatrists on duty that can help you.

Come back when you are more stress free.

High school student actually. Anyway, if Microsoft decides to make Windows unusable, and does not fix things (the latter seems less likely though), what other platforms are there that are compatible with tons of programs (including Office), and run on any x86 machine? Windows is the only one.

Not to mention how, if I have to help others with win8, that'll be a nightmare.

And also, you know how many people I know (offline) who like Windows 8? ZERO. And how many I know that don't? Several.

[waldojim]

LiveBrianD, on 20 November 2012 - 10:38 AM, said:

jazzy007, on 20 November 2012 - 07:31 AM, said:

LiveBrianD, I understand that you are a college student from your post. First let me suggest to you let the hate go away. If you do not like Windows 8, don't buy it. There are many places where you can buy a computer with Windows 7, or Mac or install Linux. I don't believe your college is making you upgrade to Windows 8. Second, don't click on every article you see about Windows 8. Just skip it and go to the next article, blog, news, etc. I feel your blood preasure is going up. You might have a heart attack. I could see the police investigator say " yes, another death from Windows 8". I am sure your college have a psychiatrists on duty that can help you.

Come back when you are more stress free.

High school student actually. Anyway, if Microsoft decides to make Windows unusable, and does not fix things (the latter seems less likely though), what other platforms are there that are compatible with tons of programs (including Office), and run on any x86 machine? Windows is the only one.

Not to mention how, if I have to help others with win8, that'll be a nightmare.

And also, you know how many people I know (offline) who like Windows 8? ZERO. And how many I know that don't? Several.

Well, you know what they say about great minds! They are great for a reason, they DON'T think like the rest. I guess that means you are dealing with average minds or worse...

[brainout]

jazzy007, on 20 November 2012 - 07:31 AM, said:

Quote

waldojim said

LiveBrianD said
I refuse to support closed platforms, metro gets in the way, and overall, the design is GARBAGE. Now how exactly do I not count? I buy copies of Windows like anyone else, and metro is costing them sales from me. And I DO use my PC for school work (Word, Eclipse). Microsoft making an OS for the few of you that like a poor design isn't going to work wery well in the long run. When you have you resort to personal attacks, you know you don't have much of an argument to stand on. Actually, I didn't. I made a comment that was because you look like a child when you post the same garbage in every thread - when the answer remains the same "DON'T USE IT". You want to stop hearing that answer, come up with a new problem. Metro is not a closed platform. Anyone is free to develop for it. By closed I was referring to the inability to install apps OUTSIDE the app store. Just like the iPhone. (with the exception of web browsers) I refuse to support those platforms on concept - it is not Microsoft's decision to decide whether or not I get to install an app on MY PC. (yes, I know that doesn't apply to the desktop, but they aren't exactly hiding metro, now are they?) Apple seems to be rather nasty in that regard, sometimes blocking apps for competitive reasons, and I don't want any chance of that under Windows 8. (that is part of the reason I don't own any Apple products) And it's a bit hard to ignore metro when they shove it all over the place, hide basic functions (start menu, shutdown, etc),change all the defaults to metro apps (with a different task manager), and have TWO Control Panels (WTF????) that have some overlapping functions, but some not. The fact that I was using the run prompt and CMD to do basic things at first because I couldn't figure out where they hid things says something about how poorly they thought it out. The fact that so far, things are looking negative for them just might have something doing with using the worst design they could think of. Oh and "Not, that you count in the slightest anyways... as someone who doesn't earn a paycheck on their PC anyhow." sounds like a personal attack to me.

LiveBrianD, I understand that you are a college student from your post. First let me suggest to you let the hate go away. If you do not like Windows 8, don't buy it. There are many places where you can buy a computer with Windows 7, or Mac or install Linux. I don't believe your college is making you upgrade to Windows 8. Second, don't click on every article you see about Windows 8. Just skip it and go to the next article, blog, news, etc. I feel your blood preasure is going up. You might have a heart attack. I could see the police investigator say " yes, another death from Windows 8". I am sure your college have a psychiatrists on duty that can help you.

Come back when you are more stress free.

I would suggest you do the same, for LiveBrianD is one of the more cogent posters in this forum. Always worthwhile to read what he says. So next time you and waldojim want to tell him he's worthless or too young, you'll make fools of yourselves, yet again. It's not 'hate' to say something's bad. It's CRITICISM, and it requires HOMEWORK, which you and waldojim, don't do enough.

Lest you quip that I'm his fangirl (at nearly 60 years old, you can't call me too young), notice that LiveBrianD and I debate, too. We don't agree on everything, but you know what -- you can LEARN from him. So please make your posts less condescending.

[waldojim]

brainout, on 21 November 2012 - 07:27 AM, said:

I would suggest you do the same, for LiveBrianD is one of the more cogent posters in this forum. Always worthwhile to read what he says. So next time you and waldojim want to tell him he's worthless or too young, you'll make fools of yourselves, yet again. It's not 'hate' to say something's bad. It's CRITICISM, and it requires HOMEWORK, which you and waldojim, don't do enough.

Lest you quip that I'm his fangirl (at nearly 60 years old, you can't call me too young), notice that LiveBrianD and I debate, too. We don't agree on everything, but you know what -- you can LEARN from him. So please make your posts less condescending.

No, he isn't. He is young, naive, and inexperienced. You would know this, if you ever learned the truth... ever. You are likely the laziest, most-uneducated 60 year old I have ever met. Most are wise enough to learn.

This post has been edited by waldojim: 21 November 2012 - 08:26 AM

[LiveBrianD]

waldojim, on 21 November 2012 - 08:26 AM, said:

brainout, on 21 November 2012 - 07:27 AM, said:

I would suggest you do the same, for LiveBrianD is one of the more cogent posters in this forum. Always worthwhile to read what he says. So next time you and waldojim want to tell him he's worthless or too young, you'll make fools of yourselves, yet again. It's not 'hate' to say something's bad. It's CRITICISM, and it requires HOMEWORK, which you and waldojim, don't do enough.

Lest you quip that I'm his fangirl (at nearly 60 years old, you can't call me too young), notice that LiveBrianD and I debate, too. We don't agree on everything, but you know what -- you can LEARN from him. So please make your posts less condescending.

No, he isn't. He is young, naive, and inexperienced. You would know this, if you ever learned the truth... ever. You are likely the laziest, most-uneducated 60 year old I have ever met. Most are wise enough to learn.

You are an idiot if you think a hodge podge of a desktop/tablet OS is well designed. Stay in your own fairy tale world if you like, but not many people are liking it elsewhere.

[waldojim]

LiveBrianD, on 21 November 2012 - 09:30 AM, said:

waldojim, on 21 November 2012 - 08:26 AM, said:

brainout, on 21 November 2012 - 07:27 AM, said:

I would suggest you do the same, for LiveBrianD is one of the more cogent posters in this forum. Always worthwhile to read what he says. So next time you and waldojim want to tell him he's worthless or too young, you'll make fools of yourselves, yet again. It's not 'hate' to say something's bad. It's CRITICISM, and it requires HOMEWORK, which you and waldojim, don't do enough.

Lest you quip that I'm his fangirl (at nearly 60 years old, you can't call me too young), notice that LiveBrianD and I debate, too. We don't agree on everything, but you know what -- you can LEARN from him. So please make your posts less condescending.

No, he isn't. He is young, naive, and inexperienced. You would know this, if you ever learned the truth... ever. You are likely the laziest, most-uneducated 60 year old I have ever met. Most are wise enough to learn.

You are an idiot if you think a hodge podge of a desktop/tablet OS is well designed. Stay in your own fairy tale world if you like, but not many people are liking it elsewhere.

Again, naive, young, and inexperienced... apparently also a loudmouth with no common sense.

[LiveBrianD]

waldojim, on 21 November 2012 - 12:18 PM, said:

LiveBrianD, on 21 November 2012 - 09:30 AM, said:

waldojim, on 21 November 2012 - 08:26 AM, said:

brainout, on 21 November 2012 - 07:27 AM, said:

I would suggest you do the same, for LiveBrianD is one of the more cogent posters in this forum. Always worthwhile to read what he says. So next time you and waldojim want to tell him he's worthless or too young, you'll make fools of yourselves, yet again. It's not 'hate' to say something's bad. It's CRITICISM, and it requires HOMEWORK, which you and waldojim, don't do enough.

Lest you quip that I'm his fangirl (at nearly 60 years old, you can't call me too young), notice that LiveBrianD and I debate, too. We don't agree on everything, but you know what -- you can LEARN from him. So please make your posts less condescending.

No, he isn't. He is young, naive, and inexperienced. You would know this, if you ever learned the truth... ever. You are likely the laziest, most-uneducated 60 year old I have ever met. Most are wise enough to learn.

You are an idiot if you think a hodge podge of a desktop/tablet OS is well designed. Stay in your own fairy tale world if you like, but not many people are liking it elsewhere.

Again, naive, young, and inexperienced... apparently also a loudmouth with no common sense.

You describe yourself so [censored] accurately sometimes...

http://lmgtfy.com/?q...ows+8+usability The results don't exactly look positive. And to top it off, if you type that into google, the second suggestion is 'Windows 8 usability nightmare', and the fourth is 'Windows 8 usability issues'. I'm not seeing anything like that with Windows 7. Indeed, you are incredibly naive, or just a troll. You belong back under your bridge, without internet access.

This post has been edited by LiveBrianD: 21 November 2012 - 02:38 PM

[waldojim]

LiveBrianD, on 21 November 2012 - 02:30 PM, said:

You describe yourself so [censored] accurately sometimes...

http://lmgtfy.com/?q...ows+8+usability The results don't exactly look positive. And to top it off, if you type that into google, the second suggestion is 'Windows 8 usability nightmare', and the fourth is 'Windows 8 usability issues'. I'm not seeing anything like that with Windows 7. Indeed, you are incredibly naive, or just a troll. You belong back under your bridge, without internet access.

Yep, no on with the children's games "Nuh uh, YOU ARE!"
Any intentions of moving on with the conversation? Or are you going to keep on with your childish games?

Awww: and now back to downvoting. Bet that makes you feel better, doesn't it? You get to feel like a real man for a moment in your sad little life.

This post has been edited by waldojim: 21 November 2012 - 04:03 PM

[LiveBrianD]

waldojim, on 21 November 2012 - 04:02 PM, said:

LiveBrianD, on 21 November 2012 - 02:30 PM, said:

You describe yourself so [censored] accurately sometimes...

http://lmgtfy.com/?q...ows+8+usability The results don't exactly look positive. And to top it off, if you type that into google, the second suggestion is 'Windows 8 usability nightmare', and the fourth is 'Windows 8 usability issues'. I'm not seeing anything like that with Windows 7. Indeed, you are incredibly naive, or just a troll. You belong back under your bridge, without internet access.

Yep, no on with the children's games "Nuh uh, YOU ARE!"
Any intentions of moving on with the conversation? Or are you going to keep on with your childish games?

Awww: and now back to downvoting. Bet that makes you feel better, doesn't it? You get to feel like a real man for a moment in your sad little life.

Ignoring the evidence again, aren't you? That's OK, because it's blatantly obvious you lack basic logic and reasoning skills, and don't have a clue what you're talking about, do you? For the better of the rest of the world, you ought to go back under your bridge, preferably without an internet connection.

This post has been edited by LiveBrianD: 21 November 2012 - 04:49 PM

[LiveBrianD]

Double post...

This post has been edited by LiveBrianD: 21 November 2012 - 04:27 PM

[waldojim]

LiveBrianD, on 21 November 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

Ignoring the evidence again, aren't you? That's OK, because it's blatantly obvious you lack basic logic and reasoning skills, and don't have a clue what you're talking about, do you? For the better of the rest of the world, you ought to go back under your bridge, preferably without an internet connection.

Did you run out of down-votes? So sorry for you.
Understand that I do fit into the top 20% of the United States. I can read, comprehend, and understand the real meanings behind what is written. There is an 80% chance, that you are not part of that group. I suspect you are not. I base this on your lack of reading skills, and how quickly you jump onto any bandwagon that fits your agenda of the week. This week it is bashing MS + Windows 8. Not long before that, it was the iPad. Truth is, you just seem to hate everything that isn't free (or close to it) and something YOU don't approve of.

Get over yourself. You are throwing around "troll" like it means something. Truth is, you are among the worst offenders. Allow people an opinion chief.

If you quit acting like a spoiled little brat, people will quit treating you like one.

This post has been edited by waldojim: 21 November 2012 - 05:37 PM

[LiveBrianD]

waldojim, on 21 November 2012 - 05:36 PM, said:

LiveBrianD, on 21 November 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

Ignoring the evidence again, aren't you? That's OK, because it's blatantly obvious you lack basic logic and reasoning skills, and don't have a clue what you're talking about, do you? For the better of the rest of the world, you ought to go back under your bridge, preferably without an internet connection.

Did you run out of down-votes? So sorry for you.
Understand that I do fit into the top 20% of the United States. I can read, comprehend, and understand the real meanings behind what is written. There is an 80% chance, that you are not part of that group. I suspect you are not. I base this on your lack of reading skills, and how quickly you jump onto any bandwagon that fits your agenda of the week. This week it is bashing MS + Windows 8. Not long before that, it was the iPad. Truth is, you just seem to hate everything that isn't free (or close to it) and something YOU don't approve of.

Get over yourself. You are throwing around "troll" like it means something. Truth is, you are among the worst offenders. Allow people an opinion chief.

If you quit acting like a spoiled little brat, people will quit treating you like one.

There's a reason I don't like the iPad. It's nowhere near as powerful as my netbook, while costing more. Lame.... And Windows 8 - you get something that's not thought out well, and there isn't a whole lot of benefit for most tasks. If I could disable metro, there's a moderate chance I (and a lot of other people) would upgrade.

This post has been edited by LiveBrianD: 21 November 2012 - 06:26 PM

[waldojim]

LiveBrianD, on 21 November 2012 - 06:26 PM, said:

There's a reason I don't like the iPad. It's nowhere near as powerful as my netbook, while costing more. Lame.... And Windows 8 - you get something that's not thought out well, and there isn't a whole lot of benefit for most tasks. If I could disable metro, there's a moderate chance I (and a lot of other people) would upgrade.

See what I mean? You simply hate to hate.

[LiveBrianD]

waldojim, on 21 November 2012 - 08:39 PM, said:

LiveBrianD, on 21 November 2012 - 06:26 PM, said:

There's a reason I don't like the iPad. It's nowhere near as powerful as my netbook, while costing more. Lame.... And Windows 8 - you get something that's not thought out well, and there isn't a whole lot of benefit for most tasks. If I could disable metro, there's a moderate chance I (and a lot of other people) would upgrade.

See what I mean? You simply hate to hate.

So I'm supposed to like reduced-functionality products? Why would I do that? Am I supposed to act like a sheep, believe the marketing, and buy a tablet that doesn't do as much as what I already have?

[rgreen4]

GENTLEMEN (I USE THE TERM LOOSELY), LET'S NOT LET THE DISCUSSION GET OUT OF HAND.