[nsiebold]

My 12-year-old nephew is getting a laptop for Christmas that has Windows 8 on it. I'm just wondering if you think that that is a good OS for a novice. He hasn't had much experience with computers (except to play games on my brother's XP machine). Even I only got a Windows 7 machine last June. From what I've read online, most people say that Windows 8 will be hard to get used to for both novices and veterans alike. As the family techie, I just fear that, come Christmas morning, I'll be troubleshooting my nephew's computer instead of enjoying my holiday.

This post has been edited by nsiebold: 28 November 2012 - 10:05 AM

[LiveBrianD]

If you want an easy to use OS, get Windows 7, NOT 8. I've tried 8, and hate it.

[waldojim]

nsiebold, on 28 November 2012 - 10:05 AM, said:

My 12-year-old nephew is getting a laptop for Christmas that has Windows 8 on it. I'm just wondering if you think that that is a good OS for a novice. He hasn't had much experience with computers (except to play games on my brother's XP machine). Even I only got a Windows 7 machine last June. From what I've read online, most people say that Windows 8 will be hard to get used to for both novices and veterans alike. As the family techie, I just fear that, come Christmas morning, I'll be troubleshooting my nephew's computer instead of enjoying my holiday.

For the average person, it takes about 30 minutes to get acquainted with Windows 8. Truth be told, if you look at reviews from people who actually use Windows 8, you will find very few real world complaints. I wouldn't worry about that laptop in the slightest.

[nsiebold]

waldojim, on 28 November 2012 - 11:02 AM, said:

nsiebold, on 28 November 2012 - 10:05 AM, said:

My 12-year-old nephew is getting a laptop for Christmas that has Windows 8 on it. I'm just wondering if you think that that is a good OS for a novice. He hasn't had much experience with computers (except to play games on my brother's XP machine). Even I only got a Windows 7 machine last June. From what I've read online, most people say that Windows 8 will be hard to get used to for both novices and veterans alike. As the family techie, I just fear that, come Christmas morning, I'll be troubleshooting my nephew's computer instead of enjoying my holiday.

For the average person, it takes about 30 minutes to get acquainted with Windows 8. Truth be told, if you look at reviews from people who actually use Windows 8, you will find very few real world complaints. I wouldn't worry about that laptop in the slightest.

Well...we shall see in about 3 1/2 weeks.

[compnovo]

nsiebold, on 28 November 2012 - 10:05 AM, said:

My 12-year-old nephew is getting a laptop for Christmas that has Windows 8 on it. I'm just wondering if you think that that is a good OS for a novice. He hasn't had much experience with computers (except to play games on my brother's XP machine). Even I only got a Windows 7 machine last June. From what I've read online, most people say that Windows 8 will be hard to get used to for both novices and veterans alike. As the family techie, I just fear that, come Christmas morning, I'll be troubleshooting my nephew's computer instead of enjoying my holiday.

First of all, your 12-year-old nephew won't have a problem with Win8 because he doesn't have to unlearn anything, he won't have any preconceived notions, and, as waldojim points out, it's very easy to learn. What you're reading online is skewed because the people that are OK with Win8 rarely post, only the complainers.

Truth be told, both Win7 and Win8 are good OSs, but since the laptop comes with Win8 I say give your nephew a chance to experience it for himself. At his age he has enough adults telling him what he should be doing.

[LiveBrianD]

In my opinion, the problem is that the way they implemented dual UIs rarely makes sense, for most usage, and they hid things. Not having any experience to relate to doesn't change that.

[smax013]

compnovo, on 28 November 2012 - 02:44 PM, said:

First of all, your 12-year-old nephew won't have a problem with Win8 because he doesn't have to unlearn anything, he won't have any preconceived notions, and, as waldojim points out, it's very easy to learn. What you're reading online is skewed because the people that are OK with Win8 rarely post, only the complainers.

Truth be told, both Win7 and Win8 are good OSs, but since the laptop comes with Win8 I say give your nephew a chance to experience it for himself. At his age he has enough adults telling him what he should be doing.

And if worst comes to worst, there are ways to make Windows 8 behave very similarly to Windows 7.

End result, I agree that someone with minimal experience with ANY OS will likely have an easier time adjusting to Windows 8 that someone who has been using older versions of Windows for years. People get "ingrained" in how they do things, so learning "new ways" of doing stuff is typically harder when you know "old ways" to do things...thus the old adage of "you can't teach an old dog new tricks".

Now, whether or not he will "get" Windows 8 will be entirely specific to him. I have seen people who get Windows (old versions), but just don't get the Mac OS...and vise versa. Different strokes for different folks. And unfortunately, you will never know until you actually "lay hands on" for a significant period of time ("trying" Windows 8 on a computer at a store does not really count...although it certainly helps.

I will note that the "younger generations" tend to be much more adaptable to new "tech" than most of us "old farts" (OK, I am more of a "intermediate fart"...but then I am also pretty adaptable too).

[smax013]

LiveBrianD, on 28 November 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

In my opinion, the problem is that the way they implemented dual UIs rarely makes sense, for most usage, and they hid things. Not having any experience to relate to doesn't change that.

That is because you come from the perspective of having used Windows for a long time.

Do you recall how long it took you to figure out that original version of Windows you used? How many things were "hidden" from you because you have never used Windows and it took you time to learn it?

The point is that you are heavily biased (not meant in a bad way) what you have been using for years and know. Since you have your ingrained ways for doing things, some thing new just "does not make sense" to the way you know how to do things. Things that are second nature and seem "intuitive" to you now likely were no so when you first learned to use Windows. I would bet that if you have first learned on Windows 8, you likely would have similar feelings towards Windows 8 that you have now towards "traditional" Windows. Of course, there is absolutely no way to ever prove this.

[LiveBrianD]

smax013, on 28 November 2012 - 07:34 PM, said:

LiveBrianD, on 28 November 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

In my opinion, the problem is that the way they implemented dual UIs rarely makes sense, for most usage, and they hid things. Not having any experience to relate to doesn't change that.

That is because you come from the perspective of having used Windows for a long time.

Do you recall how long it took you to figure out that original version of Windows you used? How many things were "hidden" from you because you have never used Windows and it took you time to learn it?

The point is that you are heavily biased (not meant in a bad way) what you have been using for years and know. Since you have your ingrained ways for doing things, some thing new just "does not make sense" to the way you know how to do things. Things that are second nature and seem "intuitive" to you now likely were no so when you first learned to use Windows. I would bet that if you have first learned on Windows 8, you likely would have similar feelings towards Windows 8 that you have now towards "traditional" Windows. Of course, there is absolutely no way to ever prove this.

Either way, I'm not sure how their idea of hiding everything like that makes sense. Idk, I find OS X to be a bit odd in design sometimes as well.

[smax013]

LiveBrianD, on 28 November 2012 - 08:53 PM, said:

Either way, I'm not sure how their idea of hiding everything like that makes sense. Idk, I find OS X to be a bit odd in design sometimes as well.

It is all in what you are used to.

Personally, I can find stuff in the Mac OS much quicker than I can in Windows...but then I use my Macs more than I use my Windows machines these days. I am then smart enough to know that this does not mean that the Mac OS is better or necessarily more "intuitive"...rather that I am just more used to it and that I personally might like it better...but others will disagree. This is a big reason why I don't typically "push" people looking for a new computer to switch to a Mac...there is a better than average chance that they will hate using a Mac since they are used to using Windows...although there are plenty of people who end up liking their new Mac after switching once they give it enough time to get used to it (and the opposite is true...i.e. when Mac users switch to Windows). Regardless, there will always people who just won't/can't switch (aka deal with change)...and many times that is fine.

The same thing basically happened with Office 2007 when Microsoft went to the "Ribbon". Those who had been using Office for years and years with menus were all of sudden force to play "hide and seek" in order to get work done. I still to this day hate the Ribbon...but then it is largely because I have been forced to use it...the Mac OS versions of Office still have menus...THANKFULLY.

Similarly, it takes me a while to find some stuff in Windows 7's (and Vista's) Control Panel since I am used to using XP. I invariably have to "switch" the view mode to a "classic mode" to help me find stuff. But, I bet for those who have not been using XP for years, they are fine with how Windows 7 does the Control Panel.

[LiveBrianD]

I suppose so. Personally, I've been using the ribbon for quite a while, and now Office 2003 confuses me. lol

For me, it's a bit odd how in OS X, you select the program as a whole in the taskbar, and they hide the instances of it a bit. (compared to Windows 7 - they sorta copied the dock, but implemented it better IMO) I also don't get the "phantom program" thing - having a program open but no instances of it.

[smax013]

LiveBrianD, on 28 November 2012 - 09:33 PM, said:

I suppose so. Personally, I've been using the ribbon for quite a while, and now Office 2003 confuses me. lol

For me, it's a bit odd how in OS X, you select the program as a whole in the taskbar, and they hide the instances of it a bit. (compared to Windows 7 - they sorta copied the dock, but implemented it better IMO) I also don't get the "phantom program" thing - having a program open but no instances of it.

For me, it is the opposite. Because I "grew up" on the Mac OS, I am used to opening a program that puts a menu across the top of the screen as a "single instance" rather than each windows of the program having menus, etc. So, it takes me a moment to "re-adjust" to how Windows does it when I sit down to Windows.

[LiveBrianD]

That form does seem a bit outdated now though, with lots programs not even having menus anymore on Windows (I notice OS X is the only platform Chrome has file menus on), or hiding them by default.

[smax013]

LiveBrianD, on 30 November 2012 - 08:47 PM, said:

That form does seem a bit outdated now though, with lots programs not even having menus anymore on Windows (I notice OS X is the only platform Chrome has file menus on), or hiding them by default.

And that is why I like the Mac OS. It has a much more consistent user interface than Windows when going from program to program. It makes finding things in a program easier...for me at least.

[LiveBrianD]

Ehh... there are some things that I find really don't need file menus (web browsers, file managers, Office, etc)... I personally I find Office harder to use on the Mac, partly for that reason.

[Szczecinianin]

Good OS for novices? As far as basic operations are concerned any OS can be used by a novice now after a brief tutorial.  The trouble starts when you want to use advanced features, the learning curve is not that steep, and in Win 8 case you need to adjust, too, to the dual GUI. And if  the boy is 12 he certainly knows the nitty-gritty as they taught(?) him that at school. And kids now seem to be natural with computers and tech so you shouldn't worry too much.

And Weronika Szmajdzińska of Szczecin is Miss Global Teen 2012.          

This post has been edited by Szczecinianin: 02 December 2012 - 01:52 AM

[doslover]

Why even give a pc laptop to a 12 year old kid anyway. I'm gifting an iPad mini to my grand niece for Christmas. It's not like she needs compatibility with her office computer or will be writing long reports on it. But if you've already made the decision, then at least give the kid a break and install Google Chrome on it as the default web browser and set up a gmail account. Even I am moving away from Windows PCs now that I'm retired from my job, and just bought myself an iPad mini, which is totally the bomb. Why buy a Windows 8 tablet PC when Apple has a totally matured product that also has great support. ?

This post has been edited by doslover: 02 December 2012 - 09:47 AM

[LiveBrianD]

Umm... maybe because it does a whole lot more? An iPad is OK if you don't need much functionality, particularly if you already have a desktop or laptop, but it can't really replace one for a lot of purposes. For instance, word processing?

This post has been edited by LiveBrianD: 02 December 2012 - 09:51 AM

[doslover]

LiveBrianD, on 02 December 2012 - 09:50 AM, said:

Umm... maybe because it does a whole lot more? An iPad is OK if you don't need much functionality, particularly if you already have a desktop or laptop, but it can't really replace one for a lot of purposes. For instance, word processing?

Sure, I just said that. But exactly how much serious word processing will this 12 year old kid be doing ? Even I don't do much word processing now that I am retired.

Oh, and btw, I just posted this from my iPad mini. And I could even have dictated it with SIRI voice recognition.

This post has been edited by doslover: 02 December 2012 - 10:01 AM

[waldojim]

doslover, on 02 December 2012 - 09:59 AM, said:

LiveBrianD, on 02 December 2012 - 09:50 AM, said:

Umm... maybe because it does a whole lot more? An iPad is OK if you don't need much functionality, particularly if you already have a desktop or laptop, but it can't really replace one for a lot of purposes. For instance, word processing?

Sure, I just said that. But exactly how much serious word processing will this 12 year old kid be doing ? Even I don't do much word processing now that I am retired.

Oh, and btw, I just posted this from my iPad mini. And I could even have dictated it with SIRI voice recognition.

First, Siri doesn't work well enough for anything longer than a few sentences
Second, schools are relying heavily on PC's for typed up reports. Writing a 1,000 word essay on an ipad would be a miserable experience.