[PCWorld]

Post your comments for Liquid cooling vs. traditional cooling: What you need to know here

[SDW48]

I saved all the hassles by buying an Alienware pc.
has 8 super quiet fans.
two of witch are 120 mm. (6 inch)
And a water cooling system that has tubes running to the cpu, north bridge,
video card, and ram.
It's been running 5 years now, without a hitch.

[Mike921]

'Aftermarket coolers like the Noctua NH-D14 can handle overclocked CPUs, albeit loudly. ' Noctua? Loudly? Perhaps you should read the NH-D14 specs again.....

[Fatesrider]

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'Aftermarket coolers like the Noctua NH-D14 can handle overclocked CPUs, albeit loudly. ' Noctua? Loudly? Perhaps you should read the NH-D14 specs again.....

I believe it was compared to the water cooled systems. And considering it throttles to speed up during heavy use, it does tend to get louder than the specs say it does. You can't have massive movements of air SILENTLY. And considering the article talked about high use, high-end, over-clocked boards, you're looking at a lot of heat.

Another thing that plays into it far more than is usually mentioned is ambient air temperatures. If the room is at 70 F, the air moving over the heat sinks is about twice as efficient in removing heat than if the air is at 80 F. The efficiency in air cooling versus ambient air temperature curve is not linear. It's exponential, with massive fall-offs in efficiency above 80 F.

In that respect, it's much better to cool with liquid in a hotter ambient environment because the build-up in heat is slower in a liquid (heat transfers more efficiently to liquid than air) and it's faster to cool liquids than metals with warmer air.

So if you have your Noctua NH-D14 with it's spec'ed 19.2 DB level installed in an uber-maxed system that's in a relatively warm environment, it's going to eventually sound like a C-130 revving up for take-off compared to a water cooled system.

[ChatTn23]

It’s just simple physics. Liquid is a better cooling medium then air, especially when dealing with conductive cooling, as is the case with CPUs. Also, for small fans to move a certain volume of air per unit time they must spin much faster than a larger fan. The faster a fan spins, the more noise they make. If you are building a desktop computer, think big. A big case can house big fans and provides capability of adding additional fans if required, especially if you are going to be running high powered graphics cards and power supplies. Unless I’m really pushing my machine near it’s limits, the loudest noise coming from it is from the hard drives.

[RNR19952]

Never thought liquid and PC's mixed, over clocking is for fools, just buy better hardware and quit wasting your time

[doccomputeur]

With both, I am quiet.
On one side the big tower and watercooling
of the other Rog silently cooled by fans
between the two, my heart hesitates

[compnovo]

doccomputeur, on 19 February 2013 - 03:46 PM, said:

With both, I am quiet.
On one side the big tower and watercooling
of the other Rog silently cooled by fans
between the two, my heart hesitates

Computer Haiku?

[JcHc3in1]

Quote

Never thought liquid and PC's mixed, over clocking is for fools, just buy better hardware and quit wasting your time

Yeah that's why both Intel and AMD have made overclocking even easier the past few years and built so much headroom in their CPUs. But hey if you just want to run everything as standard spec go right ahead be average.

Makes one wonder why you even bothered wasting your time reading this topic however. Just trolling?

[mjd420nova]

Have anyone had to cleanup after a leak?? That's one big pain, likened to a spilled coke on a laptop.

[DoctorPhate]

Quote

I saved all the hassles by buying an Alienware pc. has 8 super quiet fans. two of witch are 120 mm. (6 inch) And a water cooling system that has tubes running to the cpu, north bridge, video card, and ram. It's been running 5 years now, without a hitch.

Congrats, you paid too much.

[DoctorPhate]

Quote

Never thought liquid and PC's mixed, over clocking is for fools, just buy better hardware and quit wasting your time

I think its a case that its something you dont understand and therefore dislike. Similar to hating the guy driving the BMW M5, especially when the bastard drives like an old lady.

Overclocking allows us to buy a really good quality motherboard that will last a decade(My AMD FX55 rig which is OC'd is currently my server and I built that in 2002) then simply buy the best spec'd processor and up the speed on it to that of a higher model.

Its like buying a ferrari that has 2nd, 4th, and 5th gears removed and is limited to 100km/h because its half the price. then because we know what we're doing just remove those limitations and we've got a smoking new ferrari for half the price.

Learn how to do it, don't simply complain that others can.

[joey301]

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Learn how to do it, don't simply complain that others can.

I wish I could learn that. It can be an expensive lesson though. Maybe someday if I knew a good mentor.

[JamesVelasquez]

Why nothing about mineral oil submerged cooling

[JcHc3in1]

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Why nothing about mineral oil submerged cooling

Because that is better left to professionals or those with A LOT of experience.

[WinTard]

JcHc3in1, on 21 February 2013 - 11:06 AM, said:

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Why nothing about mineral oil submerged cooling

Because that is better left to professionals or those with A LOT of experience.

Could it be also that oil and electronics do not mix very well?
https://encrypted.go...eral+oil+creeps


https://encrypted.go...ttacks+plastics


https://encrypted.go...ated+in+plastic


While liquids are denser than air (which is also a fluid BTW, see law of thermodynamics) and are thus more efficient at conducting heat; that heat must be circulated via a pump then dissipated elsewhere via a radiator then recirculated back as cold, to maintain a suitable regular temperature. Regardless of whether that liquid is water or oil based.

https://encrypted.go...port+properties


A KiloWatt is still 1000 Watts... Regardless of the medium it heats up, whether soup, coffee, or spaghetti.

~~~~~~~~~~
Take your pleasure seriously.
~ Charles Eames

If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about answers.
~ Thomas Pynchon, Gravity's Rainbow

The truth of a theory can never be proven, for one never knows if future experience will contradict its conclusions.
~ Albert Einstein

[WinTard]

DoctorPhate, on 21 February 2013 - 04:53 AM, said:

Quote

Never thought liquid and PC's mixed, over clocking is for fools, just buy better hardware and quit wasting your time

I think its a case that its something you dont understand and therefore dislike. Similar to hating the guy driving the BMW M5, especially when the bastard drives like an old lady.

Overclocking allows us to buy a really good quality motherboard that will last a decade(My AMD FX55 rig which is OC'd is currently my server and I built that in 2002) then simply buy the best spec'd processor and up the speed on it to that of a higher model.

Its like buying a ferrari that has 2nd, 4th, and 5th gears removed and is limited to 100km/h because its half the price. then because we know what we're doing just remove those limitations and we've got a smoking new ferrari for half the price.

Learn how to do it, don't simply complain that others can.

Welcome DoctorPhate to our wonderful PC World Community! May your stay here be a pleasant and prosperous, fun filled journey.

I love the way you put things into perspective.

~~~~~~~~~~
The adjective is the banana peel of the parts of speech.
~ Clifton Fadiman

No task is so humble that it does not offer an outlet for individuality.
~ William Feather

A good hockey player plays where the puck is. A great hockey player plays where the puck is going to be.
~ Wayne Gretsky

[puc103]

Quote

'Aftermarket coolers like the Noctua NH-D14 can handle overclocked CPUs, albeit loudly. ' Noctua? Loudly? Perhaps you should read the NH-D14 specs again.....

First thing I thought as well. That fan has performance to boot and absolute silence. Its the reason you buy a noctua over these prepackaged closed loops. Silence and performance in exchange for giant size.

[JcHc3in1]

Quote

JcHc3in1 said
Why nothing about mineral oil submerged cooling Because that is better left to professionals or those with A LOT of experience. Could it be also that oil and electronics do not mix very well? https://encrypted.go...nt=psy-ab&q=mineral oil creeps https://encrypted.go...nt=psy-ab&q=mineral oil attacks plastics https://encrypted.go...t=psy-ab&q=computer chips made of silicon encapsulated in plastic While liquids are denser than air (which is also a fluid BTW, see law of thermodynamics) and are thus more efficient at conducting heat; that heat must be circulated via a pump then dissipated elsewhere via a radiator then recirculated back as cold, to maintain a suitable regular temperature. Regardless of whether that liquid is water or oil based. https://encrypted.go...ient=psy-ab&q=fluid thermodynamic and transport properties A KiloWatt is still 1000 Watts... Regardless of the medium it heats up, whether soup, coffee, or spaghetti. ~~~~~~~~~~ Take your pleasure seriously. ~ Charles Eames If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about answers. ~ Thomas Pynchon, Gravity's Rainbow The truth of a theory can never be proven, for one never knows if future experience will contradict its conclusions. ~ Albert Einstein

It's not like oil hasn't been used successfully, a lot. In fact, I've seen more than a few builds where oil has worked really well. PITA to work on such systems though.

http://www.maximumpc...ling_technology

http://www.maximumpc...dcorepc_reactor

http://www.maximumpc...led_aquarium_pc

I really don't understand the need for all the quotes you put up at the end of your comments. They just make your posts longer and make you look really bad when you can't spell a guy's name correctly.

[mjd420nova]

I've worked on systems that used mineral oil and water. Both are very messy and not for the hobbyist. Oil, just by its nature is difficult to deal with as even a tiny leak that wouldn't appear with water will spout almost invisible streams. Water is unique in that if it is kept away from vital electronics is very efficient. Adding additional air cooling( three small, quiet ones VS. one big noisy one) and ducting to improve air flow. This all comes down to maintenence, can the user do it or is a tech needed? Water needs to be treated and guarded against bacteria. New manufactured systems have demineralized, deionized water circulated directly through the substrate, eliminating the heat sink. Attachments are also available for spot cooling with epoxy attached pads on other chips as needed. Actually not as bad idea as some overclocked MOBOs will overheat buss controllers and buffers not meant to run outside its intended parameters.