[STEEDA69]

Hello all, I'm ready to install a 250G HDD on my PC (from 40G) and I am noticing that my CPU may be working too hard. Currently, I have a 1.70GHz Intel Celeron processor and my MotherBoard is a Trigem Imperial (socket 478mPGA) with an Intel i845GL Chip Set. I know it's a dinasour but I was given a brand new 250 G HDD last Xmas and I'm still only running XP. My system has been "boggy" now for a while and I was told to replace the HDD last year. So, I am thinking of upgrading the CPU as well and MAYBE adding another 512 DDR to my already 640 Mb RAM. The CPU I was looking at is the Intel P4 as they have a few 3.0 GHz CPU's but I DON'T know what bus speed to choose? Should I just choose the fastest (1066MHz)??? I also need to know whether or not I should upgrade the Chip Set??? The Last thing I am looking to do is dump a lot of $$$$ into this PC. I just need it for another year or 2! I WAS just going to stick the 250G HDD in BUT before I did, I wanted your opinions! What would the BEST CPU upgrade be for my current system???

Thanx very much for ALL your help!





STEEDA~

[Cosmo]

In all honesty, you don't have many options. The 478 is outdated, leaving you with few processors that will give you the performance boost you're looking for.

When looking for a new CPU, you want to look at the front side bus speed as well as the chip cache. A 800 FSB with a 1MB L2 cache will outperform a 800 FSB with 512KB cache. Another thing you have to check into is whether or not your motherboard BIOS will support the new processor. Check your boot screen to see if the motherboard boot shows. It will show the BIOS version for your computer. The manufacturer will have a list of motherboards and versions of BIOS. They should have the supported processors listed there. If your BIOS is outdated or will not support the new processor, you may have to update your BIOS in order to use the new CPU.

Also, check to see the max supported RAM on your motherboard. Older motherboards may not support the amount of RAM you want to throw in there. If you can only stick a gig of RAM in there and you aren't satisfied with the performance boost, you may want to look into getting a new motherboard.

If you only want it to last a few more years and don't want to spend the money, then just max out the RAM on the computer. It's a cheap boost, and is easier than running around for the fastest CPU that you can use.

Cheers,
Cosmo

[STEEDA69]

Hey Cosmo, Thanks for the advice! You know, I just realized that my motherboard only supports (recognises 512mbs RAM and I have 640 in there now (128 + 512). I thought that the processors I was looking at would function in my system because I looked up CPU's for the 478 socket boards specifically! So, you're saying that EVEN though a CPU may be listed for a 478 socket board, that it might not actually work??? How can I tell which CPU's I can upgrade with then???

I have all the info on my bios (through a neat little program called "System Info") so I don't have to reboot my comp to get that info. Anyway, I'm checking to see if there is an upgade flash for my BIOS.



STEEDA~

[coastie65]

Hey steed, Odds are the FSB is probably 333 Mhz. With a 478 socket, you get a Celeron D 350 which is 333 Mhz FSB and runs at 3.2 Ghz. Your biggest problem is the lack of Memory, which brings me to this, if you click on MY COMPUTER and look at the general specs, how much memory is showing ? coastie

[Cosmo]

As long as the socket matches it should work, assuming the BIOS supports the CPU. You should be able to stick a Pentium 4 in there. Here's a decent processor for a reasonable price. It has an 800 Mhz FSB running @ 3Ghz.

If you google for your motherboard manufacturer, you should find their site. See if they list BIOS versions and if they do, what CPUs your version supports.

[STEEDA69]

Hey coastie, when I check to see how memory is available through My comp it states 640Mbs. So, all this time I've been under the impression that I had that much. You see, my comp originally came with 128Mbs and so I threw a 512Mbs stick in beside it. However, just lately, since I've been contemplating some Upgrades, I downloaded a neat program (from this site actually) called "Systems Info for Windows v1.60" by Gabriel Topala. Now, when I run this program, it brings up all the specs of my computer etc..etc... and I noticed that under the Motherboard specs, it reads "MEMORY - Maximum Capacity - 512MBytes." So, what does that mean???? Does it mean it only Recognizes 512MBytes max or what???? Cause If I look under My Computer, it still lists my memory as 640MBytes. I know that's not a BIG difference in RAM but it IS if I plan on uping my memory to 1GB and it can only "read" half of it (512MBs).

Cosmo, is that the fastest CPU available for my system? I'm looking on my BIOS website now. They DO have an upgrade available (flash upgrade) and I'm trying to see IF they have a list of CPU's. Geeesh.... I can't tell..... this is way over my head..... Here is the link to My BIOS.

I thought that IF a CPU was made for a 478 socket motherboard, it would work. Right now I only have a 1.7GHz Celeron processor! I was told I could UP it to a Pentium 4 or a Pentium D. As it is, they have a couple different CPU's that will fit a 478 Board.

If any of you need any other info about my "system" let me know and I will post it. This program, (Systems Info) I have, tells me everything about my computer, so I can locate just about anything! Maybe I should just forget all this other stuff and just swap out my HDD like I planned. I just thought that switching out my HDD AND adding a faster CPU would make a nice difference. Right now, with the 40G HDD I have, everything is SO, SO SLOW! VERY Frustrating!



THANX



Steeda~

[coastie65]

Hey Steed, It would be helpful to know the make AND model # of your computer. I believe your MOBO will support 1 Gb of memory, but the requested info would be helpful. I tried to find that MOBO, but wasn't sucessful. I found that it was used in some eMachines computers and HPs but little else. The older Celerons used a 320 socket, and you can pretty much forget about finding anything for that socket. I'm thinking you have a 478 socket though. I don't know of a 478 socket Pentium D. Even so, I don't think the MOBO would support dual core anyway. You would also have to be careful with the Pentium 4, as the MOBO may not support HT. The main concerns beyond those two would be supportable FSB and socket type. As far as slow goes, more memory would help as well as a larger HDD. Once you go beyond less than 50% free space than your computer will likely start showing signs of slowing. Anyway, we'll do this one thing at a time. coastie65

[smax013]

STEEDA69 said:

Hello all, I'm ready to install a 250G HDD on my PC (from 40G) and I am noticing that my CPU may be working too hard. Currently, I have a 1.70GHz Intel Celeron processor and my MotherBoard is a Trigem Imperial (socket 478mPGA) with an Intel i845GL Chip Set. I know it's a dinasour but I was given a brand new 250 G HDD last Xmas and I'm still only running XP. My system has been "boggy" now for a while and I was told to replace the HDD last year. So, I am thinking of upgrading the CPU as well and MAYBE adding another 512 DDR to my already 640 Mb RAM. The CPU I was looking at is the Intel P4 as they have a few 3.0 GHz CPU's but I DON'T know what bus speed to choose? Should I just choose the fastest (1066MHz)??? I also need to know whether or not I should upgrade the Chip Set??? The Last thing I am looking to do is dump a lot of $$$$ into this PC. I just need it for another year or 2! I WAS just going to stick the 250G HDD in BUT before I did, I wanted your opinions! What would the BEST CPU upgrade be for my current system???

Thanx very much for ALL your help!











STEEDA~

Is this a build computer or a computer from a major manufacturer? I did not have a lot of luck searching for the motherboard to find out what it can handle RAM wise. I did find one site that seem to suggest that it could handle up to 2 GB of RAM, but not sure if I trust that site or not. If it is a manufactured computer and you give use the model number, then we might be able to look it up.

[coastie65]

Hey smax, I came up with virtually Squat when I looked last night. There was some indication it was installed in both HP and eMachines computers, but little else. The make and model # of the computer would certainly be helpful for sure. coastie

[smax013]

coastie65 said:

Hey smax, I came up with virtually Squat when I looked last night. There was some indication it was installed in both HP and eMachines computers, but little else. The make and model # of the computer would certainly be helpful for sure. coastie

This is the one that I found: www.memoryx.net/trimimome.html.

[coastie65]

Hmmm, you might have been onto something. That memory fits with what I had in mind for the age of the machine as he said it was old. I figured it was probably a 333 Mhz bus in that thing, but with out a little more info on the machine, it will be pure guess work. coastie

[Cosmo]

Hi STEEDA69,

I sifted through the pdf, but unfortunately they don't list the CPUs that are compatible with 6.1. They say to contact them for a list of supported CPUs. Your best bet would be to email their support and ask for a specific list of supported CPUs with 6.1, and if there is a BIOS update more recent than 6.1 and if so what specific CPUs are supported with it.

I do not know if that is the fastest CPU for your computer, but it is the fastest one from Newegg in a 478 socket.

There is a 3.4e Ghz 478 socket listed from Intel, but it is ridiculously expensive. I'm seeing them at $200+. The processor is a BX80546PG3400E P4 3.4e Ghz with 800Mhz FSB and 1Mb l2 cache.

[STEEDA69]

Hey guys, sorry for the late response. This "THING" (computer) is REALLY trying my patience! Anyway, You wanted to know the make of my comp. Yes, it IS an E-machine, a T1742 to be exact. The ONLY thing I've done to it is add a 512 stick of DDR to it's stock 128Mbs AND I also added a DVD/CD writer!

As for the BIOS, I just E-mailed them (Phoenix tech guys) and they want me to call them tomorrow for some more info on my PC so they can give me an upgrade on the BIOS. The Bios by the way is a Phoenix 6.00. Heck, Here is ALL the info!



Detected Chipset- Intel® 845G chipset family
Memory Controller- 82845G/GE/GL/GV
I/O Controller- 82801DB (ICH4)
Integrated Graphics- Intel® 82845G graphics controller

CPU-
Processor- Intel Celeron
Code Name- Willamette
Brand ID- 10
Package- socket 478 mPGA
Technology- 0.18um
Specification- Intel® CPU 1.70GHZ
Family- F Model- 1 Stepping- 3
Ext. Family- F Ext. Model- 1 Revision- EO
Instructions- MMX, SSE, SSE2
Clocks- Cache-
Core Speed- 1695 MHz L1 Data- 8 KBytes
Multiplier- X 17.0 L1 Trace- 12 Kuops
Bus Speed- 99.7 MHz Level 2- 128 KBytes
Rated FSB- 398.9 MHz

CACHE-
L1 Data Cache- 8 KBytes
Descriptor- 4-way set associative; 64 byte line size
Trace Cache- 12 Kuops
Descriptor- 8-way set associative
L2 Cache- 128 KBytes
Descriptor- 4-way set associative; 64-byte line size

MOTHERBOARD- TriGem Computer Inc.
Model- Imperial 1.03
Chipset- Intel i845GL Rev.- A1
Southbridge- Intel 82801DB (ICH4)
Sensor- Winbond 6001
BIOS Phoenix 6.00 08/26/2002

MEMORY- DDR 640 MBytes TOTAL (128 Mbs + 512 Mbs)
Frequency- 133.0 MHz
FSB: DRAM- 3:4
CAS# Latency- 2.5 clocks
RAS$ to CAS$ delay- 3 clocks
RAS# Precharge- 2 clocls
Cycle Time (Tras)- 6 clocks
DRAM Idle Timer- 16 clocks

You see, I contacted E-machines cust. service a while back about upgrading my HDD. It came with a 40G drive and I've used more than half its Memory, so it's like a snail at the moment. I have a 250G that was given to me last Xmas and I need to know form them (E-service) IF I could use the "restore" disks I got with the PC, to load windows XP onto the new HDD. They said I could BUT noted that I MAY run into a slight problem with the BIOS. They SAID that MY PC was built to certain specs and that the "BIOS" might still only read 40G when I install the new 250G drive and IF so, they could tell me how to go in and change it to recognize the entire 250Gigs! Like I said, that was a while ago. I just figured that while I was sticking in a new HDD, I might as well upgrade my CPU as well. It seems to always be @ 100% whenever I do ANYTHING! I remember reading in my PC WORLD magazine issue, exactly which CPU's could be used in a 479 socket but I cannot seem to find the article now that I NEED it! Anyway, THANK you SO much for all of your help! This place is the BEST when it comes to PC issues and help in general.

Anyway you guys, let me know if you need anything else! I have the 250G HDD standing by, ready to go in! I just need to find out IF I need an upgrade on my BIOS but I should have that squared away tomorrow!

Thanks;



STEEDA~

[smax013]

STEEDA69 said:

Hey guys, sorry for the late response. This "THING" (computer) is REALLY trying my patience! Anyway, You wanted to know the make of my comp. Yes, it IS an E-machine, a T1742 to be exact. The ONLY thing I've done to it is add a 512 stick of DDR to it's stock 128Mbs AND I also added a DVD/CD writer!

As for the BIOS, I just E-mailed them (Phoenix tech guys) and they want me to call them tomorrow for some more info on my PC so they can give me an upgrade on the BIOS. The Bios by the way is a Phoenix 6.00. Heck, Here is ALL the info!






Detected Chipset- Intel® 845G chipset family

Memory Controller- 82845G/GE/GL/GV

I/O Controller- 82801DB (ICH4)

Integrated Graphics- Intel® 82845G graphics controller


CPU-
Processor- Intel Celeron
Code Name- Willamette
Brand ID- 10
Package- socket 478 mPGA
Technology- 0.18um

Specification- Intel® CPU 1.70GHZ
Family- F Model- 1 Stepping- 3
Ext. Family- F Ext. Model- 1 Revision- EO
Instructions- MMX, SSE, SSE2

Clocks- Cache-
Core Speed- 1695 MHz L1 Data- 8 KBytes
Multiplier- X 17.0 L1 Trace- 12 Kuops
Bus Speed- 99.7 MHz Level 2- 128 KBytes
Rated FSB- 398.9 MHz



CACHE-
L1 Data Cache- 8 KBytes
Descriptor- 4-way set associative; 64 byte line size

Trace Cache- 12 Kuops
Descriptor- 8-way set associative

L2 Cache- 128 KBytes
Descriptor- 4-way set associative; 64-byte line size



MOTHERBOARD- TriGem Computer Inc.
Model- Imperial 1.03
Chipset- Intel i845GL Rev.- A1
Southbridge- Intel 82801DB (ICH4)
Sensor- Winbond 6001

BIOS Phoenix 6.00 08/26/2002



MEMORY- DDR 640 MBytes TOTAL (128 Mbs + 512 Mbs)
Frequency- 133.0 MHz
FSB: DRAM- 3:4
CAS# Latency- 2.5 clocks
RAS$ to CAS$ delay- 3 clocks
RAS# Precharge- 2 clocls
Cycle Time (Tras)- 6 clocks
DRAM Idle Timer- 16 clocks


You see, I contacted E-machines cust. service a while back about upgrading my HDD. It came with a 40G drive and I've used more than half its Memory, so it's like a snail at the moment. I have a 250G that was given to me last Xmas and I need to know form them (E-service) IF I could use the "restore" disks I got with the PC, to load windows XP onto the new HDD. They said I could BUT noted that I MAY run into a slight problem with the BIOS. They SAID that MY PC was built to certain specs and that the "BIOS" might still only read 40G when I install the new 250G drive and IF so, they could tell me how to go in and change it to recognize the entire 250Gigs! Like I said, that was a while ago. I just figured that while I was sticking in a new HDD, I might as well upgrade my CPU as well. It seems to always be @ 100% whenever I do ANYTHING! I remember reading in my PC WORLD magazine issue, exactly which CPU's could be used in a 479 socket but I cannot seem to find the article now that I NEED it! Anyway, THANK you SO much for all of your help! This place is the BEST when it comes to PC issues and help in general.


Anyway you guys, let me know if you need anything else! I have the 250G HDD standing by, ready to go in! I just need to find out IF I need an upgrade on my BIOS but I should have that squared away tomorrow!


Thanks;






STEEDA~

Here is what Crucial.com offers as the memory options for your computer (eMachines T1742. Based upon that, it would appear that you can do a maximum of 1 GB of memory. This seems to be consistant with what you have...with 640 MB, you have one 512 MB DIMM and one 128 MB DIMM. Thus, it would appear that you could buy a second 512 MB DIMM to use instead of the 128 MB DIMM...and then have 1 GB total. And it will only likely cost you about $30 or so. While I have never had Crucial.com (bought memory from them at least about 3 to 5 times) be wrong, it is still usually advisable to see if you can get an official word on what eMachines says in the maximum. Unfortunately, they don't have that information in their specs on their website...so you would have to ask them.



Based upon this information, I would upgrade the RAM to 1 GB and install the new hard drive and see how it performs. My guess is those two alone willl help quite a bit.

[coastie65]

Hey Steed, After spending some time cruising the net, I have been unable to find all that I was looking for. Your computer will run up to 2 Gb of PC2100 RAM. I would recommend you get 2 x 1 Gb sticks. As for the processor, that is some what problematic as I don't know and can't find any MOBO specs. You have a processor with 400 Mhz FSB in there. Usually with eMachines you can go to a higher FSB. For instance, this T5212 came with a Pentium D 805 ( 533 Mhz FSB ). I have upgaded to a Pentium D 925 ( 800 Mhz FSB ). You need to check with eMachines and see if your MOBO will support 533 Mhz FSB. When checking, using your Socket type ( 478 mPGA ) I found a Pentium 4 www.compuvest.com/search.jsp?search=BX80352PE2400D&advsite=nexttag this may or may not work, depending on if your motherboard will support a 533 Mhz FSB. It runs at 2.4 Ghz. and is for a 478 mPGA socket. As for the restore disk, I don't know if it will work after a HDD change. I made a major change of optical drive in an eMachines T2824 and it worked fine afterwards. It won't work if you add a Video Card and you will need to go back to the original onboard graphics to use the restore disk. It also won't work if you change the MOBO. I didn't check the P4 processor that close, but I don't think it had HT ( Hyperthreading) . You would need a MOBO that supported HT technology, in order to run a processor with HT capabilities. You would need to get that info from eMachines' tech support. I would recommend going into bios and get the MOBO info as to the board #, and also open the case and look on the MOBO and get the AA#, before calling tech support. The more info you can give them the better. coastie

[STEEDA69]

Hey Coastie; Smax, Thanks for all the help and info! Okay, so I will contact the necessary people to find out which CPU's my Motherboard will be compatable with and in the mean time I'm going to install the 250G HDD and replace the 128Mb RAM with another 512Mb stick for a total of 1G.

Coastie, not sure what you were saying in regards to my "restore" disks BUT that, unfortunately, is my ONLY source of XP and I'M certainly not about to go out and BUY a version of Windows XP at this point. I asked E-Machines tech if I could use the "restore Disks" that came with my PC to load XP (after all, it basically loads XP on my current HDD after I erase it) and they said that was NO problem at all. (plus it has some extra software which I can use). Like I said, i HAVE erased this HDD a couple of times in the past and Re-Installed XP but I've not done it in a while. Do you know where i can find a "step by step" manual or guide to installing everything? I know how to crack the case and replace the drive, and I know how to load XP and all But I won't have access to the web to ask questions IF I run into a glitch so I wanna arm myself with as much "HELP" as I can to ensure a smooth installation.

I will install my new HDD and add a 512 stick of RAM and see how this works out in terms of performance. I can always replace my CPU later IF need be! I just thought I would do everything at once, while I had the case open. In any event, I will keep you all posted on my progress.

So, THANK YOU ALL very much for all of your help and support! You ALL certainly know your Computers!



Oh, just a couple more things....

1) The tech center for my current BIOS E-mailed me and informed me that there IS an update for my BIOS. Should I install/upgrade it or leave it as is?

2) I would like to start listening to music on my PC and would therefore need to upgrade my sound card, speakers etc... any GOOD recommendations???





Thanx again;



STEEDA~

[smax013]

STEEDA69 said:

Hey Coastie; Smax, Thanks for all the help and info! Okay, so I will contact the necessary people to find out which CPU's my Motherboard will be compatable with and in the mean time I'm going to install the 250G HDD and replace the 128Mb RAM with another 512Mb stick for a total of 1G.

Coastie, not sure what you were saying in regards to my "restore" disks BUT that, unfortunately, is my ONLY source of XP and I'M certainly not about to go out and BUY a version of Windows XP at this point. I asked E-Machines tech if I could use the "restore Disks" that came with my PC to load XP (after all, it basically loads XP on my current HDD after I erase it) and they said that was NO problem at all. (plus it has some extra software which I can use). Like I said, i HAVE erased this HDD a couple of times in the past and Re-Installed XP but I've not done it in a while. Do you know where i can find a "step by step" manual or guide to installing everything? I know how to crack the case and replace the drive, and I know how to load XP and all But I won't have access to the web to ask questions IF I run into a glitch so I wanna arm myself with as much "HELP" as I can to ensure a smooth installation.


I will install my new HDD and add a 512 stick of RAM and see how this works out in terms of performance. I can always replace my CPU later IF need be! I just thought I would do everything at once, while I had the case open. In any event, I will keep you all posted on my progress.


So, THANK YOU ALL very much for all of your help and support! You ALL certainly know your Computers!






Oh, just a couple more things....


1) The tech center for my current BIOS E-mailed me and informed me that there IS an update for my BIOS. Should I install/upgrade it or leave it as is?


2) I would like to start listening to music on my PC and would therefore need to upgrade my sound card, speakers etc... any GOOD recommendations???











Thanx again;






STEEDA~

As to upgrading the hard drive, it should be straight forward...just remember what you unplugged from the old drive and plug them into the new drive in the appropriate places. There should be just two cables...and there is virtually NO WAY to mix up which is which. As to the mounting screws, just look at how the old drive is mounted and mimic that.



As to installing the RAM, if you buy from the likes of Crucial.com, they will typically include installation instructions.



As to the BIOS, you should only update the BIOS if there is some that you NEED the new BIOS for. At this point, it does not appear to be the case, so I would leave it alone. If you do eventually go for a new processor and the BIOS needs to be updated to handle the new processor, then you might need to update it then.



I will leave recommendations of sound cards to others. You might want to start a new thread to ask that question again so that it can get the "proper" attention from other forum members...right now, your question is kind of buried in this thread which does not indicate in the title that you would like advice on a sound card. Since it is a standing thread, many might not be paying attention to it...so a new thread just for the sound card issue would likely get you more responses.

[coastie65]

Hey, I agree with smax on not messing with the Bios. That having ben said, idf you upgrade a processor it MAY necessitate a Bios upgrade as mine did. As for sound cards, I will defer to others as I usually just hang with what is onboard. Speakers, Altec-Lansing and they are cheap ( $19.95 ) for one set that I saw, and the are good. I had a pair in the front of my last car. If you install a new processor, be sure and get some Artic Silver 5 Thermal Compound. Use alcohol wipes and clean the heat sink good. Apply just enough AS 5 ( about the size of a half grain of rice) to do the job, to the new processor. coastie

[STEEDA69]

Okay, I will leave the BIOS alone then unless I absolutely HAVE to upgrade it! As far as the Xtra RAM.... Do you guys think I REALLY need to bump it up to 1Gig? It's at 640Mbs right now and I thought I saw on my MOBO specs that it could only take 512Mbs?? I dunno??? I included all that info in one of my previous posts.

As far as the sound card/speakers.... I just want something which can sound a little better than the stock speakers my PC came with. Something with a little bass and some nice clean mids and highs. I was asking more about WHICH "speaker systems" were good on the market. I would guess that I would have to get a speaker system witha built in amp for bass etc...etc... Please, anyone viewing this, please feel free to chime in and lend your advice.

As far as actually replacing the HDD and RAM (physically), I'm okay with that part! It's the formatting/uploading the OS and various steps that I was needing some assistance with. What steps I need to follow when I Re-Boot with the new drive installed etc....etc... If you can offer any input on that part, that would be great. I remember reading an article somewhere regarding the steps needed in re-installing windows etc.

Thanks again,



STEEDA~

[STEEDA69]

Oh yeah, I almost forgot.... Hey Smax.... I followed that link you posted to "crucial" and saw where it said the MAX RAM for my system is 1024MBs BUT when I clicked on the "crucial system scanner" it recommended 2Gigs of RAM (1024 each slot). I wasn't about to spend $85 for the (2) 1G sticks BUT I was just gonna but one 1G stick and pair it up with the 512 stick already in my PC. However, I don't wanna do it IF my PC will only use 1G max RAM.

What do you think????

Here are BOTH of the links:http://www.crucial.c...10E16B31D926C3]


[link from smax (512 Mbs)

Crucial Scanner Results (1024 Mbs x 2 )





STEEDA~