[JulesLt]

'No one reads anymore' is from the same man who said no one wanted to watch video on the go, and I'm sure at some point said people didn't want an all-in-one phone/music player.
In other words, take it with a pinch of salt. Not so much lying as playing poker with the competition.
What drives me nuts - smart playlists can work with songs, megabytes and gigabytes but not albums. Quite often what I really want to see is the last 10-20 albums I loaded on, at album level.
Also - make it trivial to show 'albums without covers'.
Eeejokesno - useful points, but then you turned into a troll, and an ignorant one at that. I have plenty of iTunes extensions installed (last.fm, coversutra, iLike) that prove you wrong, and most of my MP3 purchases are via emusic (whose software again integrates directly with iTunes).
The iTunes file structure is easy to read, and the metadata is held in an XML format (as well as a database for speed), and on OS X at least you have the OSA scripting API (similar to Powershell on Windows, but you know, actually supported in most applications).

[elmak]

philipashlock said:

You seem pretty complacent with the way iTunes works and I'm surprised that you're not annoyed to have to use another app like VLC to do something so simple. Don't you think it'd be helpful if iTunes didn't behave this way? So many people act like Apple always gets design and UX decisions right. I'm still annoyed that you can't cut and paste files in Finder. Apple thinks that's a power-user feature or something and assumes that people should just be happy with drag-and-drop-and-delete or copy-and-paste-and-delete. Sometimes simplicity of features or UI models means that the user-experience suffers, it gets more complicated or involves a longer process.

Apple implemented copy-and-paste and cut-and-paste of files in OS X a while ago. It's in Leopard and Tiger, and as far as I know, in Panther (I might be wrong there though).

>3. No Monitoring of Music Folders
>Apple seems unwilling to acknowledge that people get music from sources other than iTunes. How else to explain the software's inability to monitor folders and automatically add new music to the library? Sure, any songs ripped from CDs or purchased from the iTunes Store get added, but that's it. If you rip discs with a different program or buy music from other stores, you'll have to import them manually. Geez, even the Microsoft Zune software monitors folders.
>
>Fortunately, solutions are available. iTunes Folder Watch, a free utility for Windows (sorry, Mac faithful), monitors designated folders, then automatically adds any newly discovered music to your iTunes library. And if you buy music from AmazonMP3 or the Rhapsody MP3 Store, those stores' download utilities will automatically add new purchases to your iTunes collection--no intervention required.

Truly iTunes doesn't offer this feature- I personally don't find it a needed one, and from a corporate point of view, most music that would 'accumulate in a folder' is probably illegally gained. Verily this isn't always the case, and as such there is a free no-downloads solution on Mac.

Create an Automator action to scan the folder for music files, add them to iTunes, then delete or move the files. Then attach that Automator action as a Folder Action in the right-click menu for the folder you want monitored. It might take a few seconds to fire up the Automator action whenever files are added based on your computer, but what do a few seconds really matter?

[starflyer]

cortelle said:

iPods are almost completely useless to anyone in the population that is blind or visually impaired.

So are cars.

[cortelle]

yes, cars too.



iPods could EASILY be forging new ground in adaptive technology, but they actually are moving backwards in that regard.



but it shure do look purdy, don't it!?

[dcortex]

"Apple implemented
copy-and-paste and cut-and-paste of files in OS X a while ago. It's in
Leopard and Tiger, and as far as I know, in Panther (I might be wrong
there though)."
but it only works on the files in the OS..not on files or groups of files in iTunes ..

Workaround is to put your library on another harddrive than the boot drive and drag the files outta the iTunes playlist or library to the desktop..they'll copy, not move!



"from a corporate point of view, most music that would 'accumulate in a folder' is probably illegally gained"

What! this is complete bull...I am aquireing my records and cassettes digitally...what if i want to add my digitized analog captures or music I've recorded in garage band ?

You assume everyone uses the store..I haven't purchased any music, and don't intend to right now.

I do use the store to purchase episodic television I've missed

[philipashlock]

How do you cut-and-paste files within Finder? I know I can use the unix mv command from a terminal, but that's not the same thing. I don't see any ability to cut files in Tiger or Leopard.
A quick google search gives you a sense of my frustration:

http://www.google.com/search?q=cut and paste finder



update: someone might respond that dragging and dropping on the same volume accomplishes cut-and-paste, but that requires an operation on the same volume and it requires two finder windows. After doing a little research I think I have a better understanding of why this features isn't available, it's an intentional limitation to forcefully thwart the possibility of errors. To be honest, I have encountered a few rare situations where a cut-and-paste operation did not complete (windows & linux) and it was a bit of a hassle to figure out where it left of (maybe less so if i knew more unix magic). I didn't lose any files, but some were in one place and the rest someplace else and it can be a cumbersome process to mitigate that error. Though that rarely ever happens and it's only an issue with lots of files and you wouldn't actually lose any files, you might just disturb the original folder structure. I still think cut-and-paste should be an option, even if it has to be enabled using "defaults write com.apple.finder ..." from a terminal



Futhermore, I'm looking into this: www.apple.com/downloads/macosx/system[udisk[/u]utilities/xfolders.html]- hopefully it can help alleviate some frustrations. I tried to add this update this post so that people wouldn't respond to it, kind of a worn out complaint about the finder and off-topic for this thread.

[elmak]

dcortex said:

>> Apple implemented copy-and-paste and cut-and-paste of files in OS X a while ago. It's in Leopard and Tiger, and as far as I know, in Panther (I might be wrong there though).

Quote

but it only works on the files in the OS..not on files or groups of files in iTunes ..

Workaround is to put your library on another harddrive than the boot drive and drag the files outta the iTunes playlist or library to the desktop..they'll copy, not move!

True, you cannot copy a file directly from iTunes into the filesystem via the copy-paste method... I don't know of any program on any OS capable of that.

Concerning your workaround, the iTunes Library can be anywhere- dragging a song out of the iTunes window will copy it to wherever it is dragged. Moving the actual file would be an inappropriate action for the software: If you have iTunes set to organize the music library, it must maintain it's own order of files; you can't just move things away. Assuming the other option that you've chosen to organize your iTunes media yourself, go move the file on your own from wherever you put it originally; iTunes isn't a file manager program.


>> from a corporate point of view, most music that would 'accumulate in a folder' is probably illegally gained

Quote

What! this is complete bull...I am aquireing my records and cassettes digitally...what if i want to add my digitized analog captures or music I've recorded in garage band ?

You assume everyone uses the store..I haven't purchased any music, and don't intend to right now.

I do use the store to purchase episodic television I've missed

I'm not saying you don't have legally acquired music to add to iTunes; however I do believe that a vast majority of users don't. As for the iTunes Store, I'm not assuming everyone uses it- I personally have only ever used it when someone gives me an iTunes Gift Card. I would say that of majority of iTunes users, most music in their library is either imported during the first initial run of iTunes, via ripping a CD using iTunes itself, or from an illegal source. (Yes I know that I'm saying the majority of people pirate music- it happens)

You are an exception to the majority- I didn't intend to imply that everyone followed the strict regimen of my post.

[elmak]

philipashlock said:

How do you cut-and-paste files within Finder? I know I can use the unix mv command from a terminal, but that's not the same thing. I don't see any ability to cut files in Tiger or Leopard.

A quick google search gives you a sense of my frustration:

http://www.google.com/search?q=cut and paste finder

Well, I stand corrected. I had thought that It was possible to cut-and-paste items with items in the Finder, but I am mistaken. Copy-and-paste items works properly, but the cut option is disabled. There is a preference-switch in com.apple.finder that enables the cut option for files; however it appears half-complete. Instead of placing the selected file on the clipboard, it merely moves the file to the trash.

Of note, in the absence of cut-and-paste you can copy a file then immediately delete it with cmd-delete. The file remains in the clipboard even when the source file is deleted. Additionally, in the standard click-and-drag method of moving files- if you want to move but not copy a file to an drive other than where the file is located (in which case it would copy the file instead of move it), you can force the Finder to move the by holding down the cmd key.

[dcortex]

" I had thought that It was possible to cut-and-paste items with items in the Finder"



don't give up that thought as you are right because you can easily use Command-Drag
to Move to new location without copying
it equals "Cut" on MAC OS X
it works for me in Leopard (sorry about this digression)

and yes earlier versions (they fixed it) of iTunes would move a file if it was on the same hard drive if'n you dragged the item outta a playlist (they fixed this in iTunes 5, iThink)

[bobthedino]

"So why does the iTunes Store still employ digital rights management (DRM) for the majority of songs in its library? Blaming the record labels no longer holds water"
Actually, you can blame the record labels. In an attempt to reduce the dominance of the iTunes Store, they allow Amazon and the others to sell DRM-free music, but not Apple.
See: http://www.nytimes.c...gy/14clash.html

[zeth006]

Wow...is Apple creating a full scale cult through its sales? 487 approved of this article, 446 disapproved. Interesting. I guess the cult leader Steve Jobs is doing a good job of inspiring a sense of belonging among his following.

[JulesLt]

What, people responding to an article with the word 'Hate' and an Apple product in the title? It couldn't possibly provoke a strong reaction!

Ah, yes, the cult of Jobs. It's certainly true that Apple users report some of the highest levels of customer satisfaction in the industry, and that they become passionate about the companies products, and indeed the company does inspire a sense of 'belonging' in many of it's users - something a lot of companies would love their customers to have.

Of course, they spend a lot of money in developing that - from the retail stores, through to the packaging. It pays off in creating an army of unpaid sales people.

But the key thing is that it's about delivering products people want / love - from the mid-90s to early 2000s they didn't and sales fell. It's a mistake to think that it is all just about marketing and surface design.

Linux equally has an army of advocates / unpaid sales people, because it's users feel a positive attachment. You don't hear of Ubuntu paying bloggers to mention it's products in a positive context.

[cyclonus]

Have you tried party shuffle? I think it should suffice for seamless playback of sequenced music while multitasking.

[djsyntek]

Sorry Itunes is crap on both OSX and Windows. If you don't want to sync an entire folder of songs (we'll say 30gbs of music) to you 8Gb iphone. You have to put it in manual mode and choose which songs. I could never find an equalizer for the player. There no options when installing what features to install and what to leave out. I now have insanely annoying pop-ups about downloading quicktime updates and the new version of itunes even though I don't use quicktime and itunes is up to date. I don't want the web browser that comes bundled with the software. To disable quicktime and others from starting up, you have to edit your start.ini file (through msconfig or autoconfig). Those are just for itunes so you can put msuic on your mp3 device. As far as a media player goes. Its shit. xmplay, winamp, and vlc are all much better and lighter.

[ElectraGlide]

Converting the "value" of currency is a very interesting subject. Could it be the fact that the value of your efforts for an hour's work is 55% less valuable, thus making our product more expensive? Or is the market dictating the fact that you wil pay 1 euro to get the song, so that what it will be priced at? or is it an accounting efficiency for Apple? That's the real reason in all probability...1 whatever per song. or almost 1 (.99) It gets interesting when you bring the "price" of gold in the factor. The truth is both our currencies are "fiat" currencies- essentially worthless. Now, don'tyou feel better?

[philipashlock]

Not sure I understand your suggestion - isn't party shuffle, by definition, randomized and not sequenced playpack? I'm looking for control over the music that's playing. I don't want my music to stop playing just because I started playing it while browsing through albums in my library. An album should only stop playing if I hit stop or if I start playing something else, not just because I'm browsing the library. Furthermore, I should be able to transition the currently playing track to be active in any context, in any playlist.

[eeejokesno]

@[~166724]



What I mean by locked down is that Apple controls every nook and cranny of your computing experience with a Mac. For OS X, this means that you will use the stupid, ugly dock, even if you think that a slim menubar is much more productive. You will have a translucent menu bar if you have Leopard. It's so idiot proof that you can't change the most basic of settings. You couldn't even put Windows on an Intel Mac until Apple released a utility allowing you to bypass their propietary BIOS. On the music side, the iPod will only work with the iPod because Apple developed their own PC-Player protocol instead of using availible industry standards. Everything Apple does points to their desire to control you. If Apple releses a new set of iPods, it is almost guaranteed that they are set up so that non-iTunes users (Linux) cannot use them without re-hacking the iPod drivers. The first-gen iPhones that were hacked, then bricked (on purpose) by Apple's iPhone update. The only thing that update did was kill iPhones that had been modded There is even a backdoor in the iPhone that lets Apple erase any app. Jobs says that it is for security. The point is that Apple dosen't trust you with its technology.

[eeejokesno]

Couple of other thoughts. I hadn't really thought about extentions. I've never really given iTunes a chance. It has so many obvious annoyances that I usually give up before I find a workaround.

One more iTunes gripe, though. It should use the OS's native codec engine. In Windows, this would mean that some M4A and Apple Lossless DirectShow filters would be installed. This would also mean that WMP could play iTunes songs, which is probably why they don't do that. Still iTunes should be able to play flac, ogg, wma(w/o converting it), etc.so that I don't have to worry about my music's format. All of my Linux players do this. (though admittedly, WMP does not.)

[technicalhitman]

Lets look at iTunes' competition. WinAmp currently downloads at 10.8 MB. The XP version of Windows Media Player is 25 MB. iTunes version 7.7 bundled with Quicktime comes in at a whopping 77 MB. If Apple really wants to make people use Apple hardware and software, shouldn't Apple demonstrate better software writing and efficient app writing on the opposition platform? Instead of a well written and functioning media player, we get something that keeps growing bigger and bigger over time. iTunes is slow and bogs down systems with system processes even when its not running. This makes me less inclined to use more Apple products than not. Then being part hypocrite about bundling, they bundle Quicktime with iTunes. Apple tries to shove Safari down our throats and pre-checks the download box. They are acting more notorious than Microsoft. Along with the security issues in Safari, Apple software clearly has a security and bloat issues.

I think Apple should put SnowLeopard on hold, while they fix Safari, iTunes, Mobile Me, Quicktime, and the OS-X versions of the same. What will it take to wake up the Mac community to these issues? Another internet worm/virus that brings down Macs by the millions? I don't believe Apple is taking security that seriously while Microsoft has made some serious gains that area. Thats why I am hoping this renewed media pressure on Apple will result in some culture change in Culpertino.

[dcortex]

If you need quicktime on your computer, bundling doesn't bother you.
They figgure if'n they don't bundle it , potential customers of the music video fare on iTunes store would be faced with "dammit another friggin download"
Its that Safari pushing we shouln't stand for..or that Apple Software Upper thingy


Quicktime rocks compared to WMP especially..you get frame-by-frame advance and a host of other superior features in QT.


Winnamp has all this fcking AOL sh*t in it ...I use version 2.61 by Justin for the reason that it super for individual plays, but search and manage dont function usuably in Winamp, and it often renders Metadata entered anywhere else but winamp itself strangely (in my experience)