[TechieXP]

Bryce!

That brings back some memories.

How about Maya?!

[rasmasyean]

I don't think some of you get that subtle hint I tried to poke in regarding your ridiculous arguments about solder vs socket.
If a CPU is plugged into a socket...and a socket is soldered to the PCB, then the CPU is soldered to the PCB, for "failure possibilities".
As a matter of fact, when you have a CPU (or any connector) plugged into a socket, you have 2 points of possible failure...the socket AND the solder. What do you think? A socket grows on the PCB and is natively attached? NO. Neither are any "military plugs" grown off a PCB. They are all soldered to the PCB!
You guys are all too bent up on arguing with eachother and trying to make up analysis arguments to "win" that you all overlook the obvious.

[GetReal]

Soldering: good points all, except, your "always cheaper to manufacture" point. Components during PCB manufacture for ages have been initially soldered on "wave solder" machines or much more modern variants, and to this point, IS the cheapest method. However, failure rates are typically high here unless the operators are super skilled, so then rework comes into the process to correct bridging, poor flow, pits, etc., AKA, humans with soldering irons or..., at this point labor costs skyrocket and otherwise usable parts are discarded because of abuse during repairs-removal-desoldering. Overall, high value components are cheaper if socketed as opposed to solder.

Industry trade journals state that "lead-free" soldering is just as reliable as conventional, by both test & analysis, but you are correct in that this process is still developing and many manufacturers are slow to understand, be concerned or apply correctly.

Anyway, I won't say more about this as all relevant points have now been discussed & it gets to nit-picking. Sorry all! :-) Yes, I did get the hint.

[dragon69]

rasmasyean





" You guys are all too bent up on arguing with each other and trying to
make up analysis arguments to "win" that you all overlook the obvious. "





this is not a competition here . we all should be able to discuss things like adults and perhaps learn something from others view points ( so i guess the real winners here would be all that learned something new here) and debate the key points a bit . and yes everyone misses somethings here and there but we try to be thorough when possible





gl e1 and tc





:-)

[WinTard]

rasmasyean said:

I don't think some of you get that subtle hint I tried to poke in regarding your ridiculous arguments about solder vs socket.
If a CPU is plugged into a socket...and a socket is soldered to the PCB, then the CPU is soldered to the PCB, for "failure possibilities".
As a matter of fact, when you have a CPU (or any connector) plugged into a socket, you have 2 points of possible failure...the socket AND the solder. What do you think? A socket grows on the PCB and is natively attached? NO. Neither are any "military plugs" grown off a PCB. They are all soldered to the PCB!

You guys are all too bent up on arguing with eachother and trying to make up analysis arguments to "win" that you all overlook the obvious.

Come on, nobody is trying to win anything, other than 'educate' ourselves via considering different viewpoints and experiences... You know thought provoking ideas? Unless you are? (Trying to win an argument that is)?

~~~~~~~~~~
Honest disagreement is often a good sign of progress.
~ Mahatma Gandhi

Without continual growth and progress, such words as improvement, achievement, and success have no meaning.
~ Benjamin Franklin

We are approaching a new age of synthesis. Knowledge cannot be merely a degree or a skill... it demands a broader vision, capabilities in critical thinking and logical deduction without which we cannot have constructive progress.
~ Li Ka Shing

The perfecting of one's self is the fundamental base of all progress and all moral development.
{Chinese Proverb}

The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress.
~Joseph Joubert, 1754-1824, French Moralist and Essayist

[quackadilly]

Maya is some great stuff. Ever use Rhino 3D? Great 3D modeling software....if you get the chance, try it.





Some pictures in their galley:














Sorry for the OT......

[smax013]

TO ALL:

Please stay on topic. And please refrain from personal attacks, name calling (i.e. calling each other Trolls), and delving into politics.

[rgreen4]

Since most everything related to the original topic has been said, and the topic has shown a tendency to drift far off topic, this thread has been locked.

[Vulpinemac]

How many of you seriously read this article after reading the "Eight Reasons for Mac" one? Sheesh! This came out as, "Why should you buy the best when second best is good enough?"

Yes, I'm a Mac user. I'm also a Windows user. I understand the advantages and disadvantages of both.

So why do I use a Mac? I like it better, that's why.
* I don't worry about getting viruses or other malware -- This doesn't mean I can't get them; it doesn't mean it's not possible--but the odds are still very high in my favor that I won't any time in the near future. It's a matter of comfort as compared to fear.

* On the average, the software for OS X seems easier to use. In most cases the software is designed for efficiency and intuitive operation--even to the point of making some functions so accessible that people used to the Windows way have trouble finding them. Why search through several levels of nested menus when it's only a right-click away?

* On average, my Macs have been more reliable than the PCs I've owned, including ones I built myself. One of my biggest complaints I've had with every PC I've owned is that the power supply rarely lasts longer than two years. Why? Of all the Apples and Macs I've owned, only one died of a power supply failure, and that was at 5 years old. Even now I'm using a 9-year-old iBook, a 7-year-old Mac Mini, a 5-year-old MacBook Pro (first gen Intel) and two 2-year-old iMacs. Even going back through my full history of Apple products, the idea of getting 11 years out of a single power supply (An Apple II that I maintained myself and upgraded to full IIe capability) was almost unheard of with any other brand.

*Just as importantly, OS X has tended to be more stable than any version of Windows I have ever used, up to and including Vista. This doesn't mean I haven't had issues with OS X (I tend to always have permissions problems on upgrades,) but once those issues are resolved, the OS is stable and reliable. I haven't even seen any kernel panics since I upgraded to Tiger (I'm now in Snow Leopard.) While I admit I haven't experienced any BSODs with Vista, there are still times when it's just more efficient to reboot and hope whatever was causing odd behavior is resolved by essentially resetting the memory. Even my newest Windows-only game, Champions Online, gives me weird video issues on occasion, even after installing the newest possible video drivers. I don't get that kind of issue when running OS X.

*Of course, this points out one of the most important features now--Macs can and will run Windows natively while still giving you the ability to take advantage of OS X. This means I can run those Windows games and not have to worry about security as much; I don't browse the Web or download email in Windows, so I avoid the most common attack vectors in use today. This doesn't mean I'm not running an AV--I'd be a fool not to--but as yet, neither my Vista install nor OS X have been actively attacked.

In essence, a Mac today is probably the most universal tool available for everyday computing. You may think it costs more, but if it can do more, isn't it worth the price?

[Vulpinemac]

WinTard, on 11 June 2009 - 08:54 PM, said:

We agree! Soldering is no better or worse than contact, depending on the application. Soldering a component to a PCB usually costs less than soldering a socket then adding the component at the manufacturing level. Thus a socketed component always costs MORE than otherwise, due to a) the cost of the gold-plated socket, the requirement to solder the socket to PCB and c) additional manufacturing step to populate said socket... Conclusion, no socket = soldering = always cheaper to manufacture... But not always more reliable or serviceable...

As for the application, let's switch from vibrations and harnesses to a typical high-temperature thermocouple... In high-temperature applications, soldering is less reliable than a crimped / connector electrical contact. Always. Unless one uses welding instead of soldering...

High-temperature thermocouple: Welded at the tip (sensing end) and usually screw-clamp connector at the other end, solid wire to braided wire.

How do I know? When firing ceramics for computer devices (ferrites) you have to 'soak' them in a kiln at nearly 2,000°F for a certain amount of time. You've got to monitor that temperature somehow, don't you.


(Aren't I mean, commenting on a thread three months after the discussion ends?)

This post has been edited by Vulpinemac: 25 September 2009 - 11:56 AM

[KStrawn]

PCWorld, on 26 April 2009 - 05:00 PM, said:

Post your comments for Eight Reasons Your Next Computer Should Be a PC here

Did anybody ever mention Linux here? I doubt it. Linux computers and devices are even more diverse, from phones and pocket computers to million-box hives. The Linux Ext4 file system supports up to an exabyte of hard drive space, not to mention the very file system being 64 bit. Yet Linux also supports every processor from Intel to AMD to PPC to Itanium to Sparc to ARM, meaning virtually anything can run it.

[lutra]

The esoteric nature of Linux is its downfall though. Even with the current generation of distributions, it still requires a fair amount of knowledge of computers, file systems, terminals and an ability to search the web for answers to even some of the most simple problems. Want to play a game? Well, you'll need WINE and time to configure the emulator, solve any sound input/output, video or performance problems you may have. If the game is an MMO, then good luck because WINE is seen as a third party program and people have been banned from MMOs for using it. It wasn't until just recently that you didn't have to mount drives before you could use it. If you need help for Linux, there's really nobody to call. You just have to ask at forums, chat in IRCs and so on, assuming you can get online to get the help in the first place. It's a good thing that Linux is free because nobody would pay for the problems they have to deal with.

Windows and OSX, on the other hand, "just work." As long as you ahve the right hardware and software combination.