[1MacGeek]

rfceo said:

h4. There are several hundred "officially blessed developers"

Who aren't doing jack right now because they can't release their programs. Hence, they are still unofficial. There is still no official SDK, and there won't be until the fall. Hence, the unofficial.

For the last time - LAY OFF THE WEED. You're just not making sense because of it.

[davoaxiom]

Games on the Pre, check this out - http://www.youtube.c...jqU&feature=fvw

One of the main ideas behind the Pre which makes it hands down better than Apple is that it is Open source. This creates a situation that developement of apps is completely wide open. Very much unlike Apple's "Where's my money bitch?" business practices.

As far as overheating and battery life, Palm has been addressing the issue from the start. They haven't said there wasn't an issue. In fact they have updated the OS twice within the first couple weeks of the release. Also these were over the air painless updates, I might add. Like any product there is usually defects, I for one have not had a battery issue, Usually charge over night and plug it in if I'm playing music in the car. I would say that I spend between 1 to 2 hours talking a day and off and on data uses often with 3 to 4 apps open. I've only seen my battery get below 20% once and that was only after streaming music for an hour straight while traveling. Since the last update the lowest I've seen is 32%. I've never changed the e-mail settings and I'm signed in to AIM and Gtalk. Either I have the wonder unit or this was only a situation where I have good coverage and sign in to wifi at home and work. The only time I've noticed the phone heating up was charging in the car and it's a little warmer after sitting on the touchstone. Strange as it sounds I've noticed it less and less as time goes on. Like the battery is adapting or creating a memory.

The biggest thing is I will put up with a shorter battery life for multi-tasking. I spend a lot of time jumping from messing, talking on the phone, calendar and e-mail. It is so much faster to just go from card to card. Plus I really like the UI and really have found it faster than WM, Blackberry and iPhone. Sorry I can launch apps, pull up contacts and reply faster on the Pre.

The thing is that Palm has shown that Apple is wrong you can do more than one thing at a time on a smart phone. Sure there maybe a reduced battery life but who really doesn't charge their phone for a week?

[rfceo]

h1. Activision Anthology for Palm OS

Supported Devices

Palm Centro, LifeDrive, Pre (Classic), Treo 650, Treo 680, Treo 700p, Treo 755p, Tungsten C, Tungsten E, Tungsten E2, Tungsten T3, Tungsten T5, T|X, Zire 72,




store.handmark.com/p/123509/Palm-OS/Activision-Anthology-for-Palm-OS/



You wanted one from Activision as I stated before there are currently over a thousand apps that will run on the Pre using the Clasic emulator


http://store.handmar...php?device=1074

I think they List 98 games that will work on the Pre(clasic)

[1MacGeek]

davoaxiom said:

One of the main ideas behind the Pre which makes it hands down better
than Apple is that it is Open source. This creates a situation that developement
of apps is completely wide open. Very much unlike Apple's "Where's my money
bitch?" business practices.

Are you addressing the business practices which are making Apple and the developers a lot of money?

davoaxiom said:

Strange as it sounds I've noticed it less and less as time goes on.
Like the battery is adapting or creating a memory.

Which is almost impossible to do with a lithium polymer battery... I am happy you do not have the problems others are having, but if I had to put money on it, I would say you do have the wonder unit.

davoaxiom said:

Sorry I can launch apps, pull up contacts and reply faster on the Pre.

Which, to my knowledge, nobody has disputed. I have said, however, there is a price to be paid for this. Some around here have tried to repeal the laws of physics to deny there has to be a tradeoff.

davoaxiom said:

The thing is that Palm has shown that Apple is wrong you can do more than one thing at a time on a smart phone.

I am not sure how this shows anything. Apple has consistently said they came up with the best compromise for maximum battery life, and it would be hard to prove them wrong by their market share. But at the same time they sure don't tell anyone to disable everything that makes an iPhone an iPhone just to use the blessed thing. If one does that, what is the point? And this is precisely my point on the Pre - if you have to quit doing everything in which you perceive the Pre gives value, why have the Pre in the first place?

[1MacGeek]

rfceo said:

You wanted one from Activision as I stated before there are currently
over a thousand apps that will run on the Pre using the Clasic emulator

1. That wasn't a press release from Activision detailing support, now or in the future, for the Palm Pre. LAY OFF THE WEED.

2. If all the software runs on a regular Palm, what reason is there to buy a Pre?

3. LAY OFF THE WEED.

4. LAY OFF THE WEED.

Really, man. You are really embarrassing yourself.

[achristie]

"I am happy you do not
have the problems others are having, but if I had to put money on it, I
would say you do have the wonder unit."

Dude! The VERY link that YOU posted contained NUMEROUS posts from people who either never had the problem, or had the problem and was able to resolve it. The link that YOU posted proves that HE doesn't have a wonder phone. Well, I guess you're right, the Pre is a wonder phone in general. But MOST people do NOT have that problem and the issue is NOT widespread! And why are you focusing on an issue that the IPhone 3GS shares to try to discredit the Pre? it doesn't say much for the iPhone, now does it?

You are making a complete ASS out of yourself.

Oh, and did you ever answer my question about which area you live in so that I can double check your claim that Sprint stores have plenty of stock? NOOOOOO!!!! Why not? Because you pull crap out of your ass and post it as fact! Your credibility SUCKS! But you know what, Palm can't win with you guys no matter what they do. If they are sold out with no inventory, then you guys call it piss poor planning. If they have inventory, then they're not selling enough phones. Whatever!

Lay off the CRACK!

[bulletstorm]

I agree, no matter what it's said, the Pre keeps getting bashed by people that dont even have or even tried one out yet.

[TechieXP]

@1MacGeek
Verizon didn't turn down the iPhone. The deal didn't get done bec Verizon wanted to change the interfaceof the phone to run verizon specific software....like ALL carriers do. ATT was teh only one who would work with Apple to keep the phone as is...but ATT took a bigger chunk of the pie to keep it that way.
Also I think Sprint even tho they have a pretty ok network, is simply a dying carrier. I think Sprint lost out as a carrier bec of bad customer service. And they aren't very good at marketing. They did very good with the Instinct.
However I didagree with RIM being ahead bec they are giving phones away. BB is just a better business based phone and more secure to use with business eail. Not everyone was giving BB's away. Verizon did a deal where you could get 2 for 1...however BB was already ahead even before then. Also they must be doing something right...they have 3 phones in the top 5. Even over companies that have smartphone experience like Palm and MSFT.
I don't think any touchscreen phone should ever be assumed to be an iPhone killer. I do agree when you said it should be considered as a possible iPhone alternative. The Instinct is a cool phone...but I wouldn't have pit it against iPhone either.
I think in reality there is only one company that could dethrone Apple and iPhone and that is MSFT. They are the only ones who have the money, the name and the partners to do it. The market has been pressuring them to into the cellphone market with their own phone. Rumor has it that MSFT may do so. They have the touch experience as teh Surface PC is proof MSFT could certainly beat Apple. And by the way the look of iPhone was swiped from the LG Prada which was also a full touchscreen phone.
The Zune HD is touted to be even better than the Apple Touch. As long as MSFT doesn't try to turn the Zune HD into a cellphone, and make a eye-pleasing masterpiece and throw Windows Mobile 7 on it with fill touch and have a Surface PC like UI...MSFT can beat Apple. Time will tell and when and if anyone actually beats iPhone, then the words iPhone Killer will apply. Until then iPhone is simply king of the touchscreen phones and RIM is king of the Smartphone hill. iPhone is not a smartphone or PDA. Its a music player with the calling features. Its a glamorize iPod just like the Touch is. It is a multimedia phone that has a few business tools added...however even tho iPhone has software to use Domino and Exchange email...it will never be as good as a Windows Mobile phone or Blackberry on this front. It is simply a fancy consumer phone bec that is who is standing in line to buy them.

[Biggkatt01]

Bulletstorm check my earlier post, I am bashing the unit because I have first hand knowledge of it.My sister had 1 and returned 1 and for anyone to say that someone gave links to information that was not true it's Palm's own users that are bashing the phone to.

The Palm Pre users on Palm's support forum, Which I read alot of said how they were having problems some called Sprint and some called Palm and alot of them said they got shitty treatment by both. So don't say that Palm was addressing the problems Pre owners reported palm was brushing them off. So stop it with this stupid talk about how no one was reporting problems and Palm was taking care of the problem

These are a few qoutes from Palm's site from seperate posters.



"Unbelieveably, I just spoke to Sprint and they basically said I was out
of luck until more Pre's come available. What a piece of crap. I
can't believe I left my blackberry for this. Never again. This is the
worse device and customer support EVER."

"They have to fix this, it's becoming too huge an issue on the internet. Palm and Sprint can't have this much bad pub."

" Palm, you better get your stuff together. I have been an AVID palm fan
since its inception. I have waited since January to get this phone. I
got it on the first day. Now, I understand you do not want to throw
all of your eggs in one basket because you will be release newer
version and we need some incentives to buy it...but....COME ON!!!!!
The flagship of this phone is the MULTITASKING!!!!!!!!!! If the
battery will not last a full day, the MULTITASKING goes right down the
drain...You guys did a really really good job of keeping the poor
battery under wraps. I must say i am so diappointed....i thought, i
can deal with the slow internet without wifi, i can deal with no video
recorder...hell, i could even learn to get used to having that creepy
guy Jim that i met through a friend at that shady bar in my contacts
list because he couldn't wait to get home and add me to
facebook(sigh)....but....I CAN NOT take a battery that
does not last all day!!!!!!!!!! I defended you guys all night at my job
while i was showing my new phone's cool internet features even though
the internet was slower than dial up to load a video from the U Tube
app because we don't have wifi......I am so upset about this right
now....any other diehard palm fans with me on this HUGE DISAPPOINTMENT who SWORE that
they would defend palm against all those stupid apple fanboys and
girls...i never thought i would say this but....i wish i had
a.........UGH!!! Its no use......."

"I also downloaded the new update but still the same issues... Also
having problem turning on the phone after I take the battery out and
put it back in. The screen gets stuck at black screen with "Palm" in
the middle."



Ok so don't say there are taking care of the problmes because like I said Pre users are reporting this not me and there are still complaibts even after the new firmware,So be honest with yourself I know you want the phone to suceed so bad that its blinding your view ,But as I said nothing will get done if Pre owners don't band to gether and fight to have them fix the problems at once.

[TechieXP]

@MacGeek.
So....since Apple only sells 2.5 million Macs per quarter and Dell sells 15 million that would certainly means Macs are a failure right?
Oh and be4 iPhone the hottest phone on the market was the Razr V3..with the model selling where iPhone is now.
Apple is a niche player always have been always will be. So does that means every device they sale is a failure. I would say based on the success of iPhone and your logic...ever piece of hardware Apple ever sold is a failure in comparison...wouldn't u say?
According to factual numbers...before 2006 Apple sold on average 1.5 million Macs per quarter. This number remain around this number from the Time the Mac was first released until late 2006. While PC makers like HP and Dell and even Compaq enjoy results that were 5 to 15x better...so that means Macs are surely a failed product...right?
Apple surely did a great job market the iPod and simply built on that success with a fancier version in the Touch. Adding calling to a device that was already with huge popularity was a no-brainer. And again following up on the success of a previously released product which happened to be their own.
I see ur a fan i iPhone and that is fine...but teh Pre isn't a failure. A failed product in this industry is one NOBODY buys...I would say the people who will be stronger buyers of the Pre, will mostly be owners of previous Palm devices like the Treo. I had the 700w from Sprint and it was teh best phone I ever had...i dumped it for the Centro which sucked and the instinct tho nice was basically a pretty toy and ended up being a bit disappointing. I have Storm now and is surely better than Iphone in many respects. One being I can make the changes I want without jailbreaking the phone. I also like not being locked to a software. My battery last just as long or longer than iPhone on a full charges as it has lasted close to a week on a full charge with average usage. I can change the interface to mimic other phines including yours...I can use 8GB, 16GB and 32GB of flash memory and upgrde at anytime at a marginal cost vs iPhone. Also I can take full advantage of ALL features...unlike ATT who is charging iPhone users for features you can't even use even tho the phone can do it...like MMS. No big deal right...bec it is perfect OK for ATT to charge you $30 extra for 50% service...right?
Oh the worlds largest landline owner has the worst cellphone network in history. Even Sprint and T-Mobile are better.
Apple and ATT make good partners bec they both have something in common...They are greedy in that they charge you more money for less stuff...this is true of ALL markets Apple has ever entered. The Mac certainly is a nice computer but is proof that looks are more important than anything else...which is why Macs aren;t used in business...ATT also like to overchange for stuff and provide less service. At Sprint...for 99$ you can use unlimited data everything related to ur ohone. What to use phone as modem? Sure! on;y 39.99 extra for UNLIMITED usages while others including ATT have 5GB maxxes.
I want an iPhone too. One problem...I hate ATT period. I don't care if they even had the best network in history. In fact they are the leader at being the MSFT of the communications industry. NO ONE LIKES THEM. NOT EVEN APPLE.
At teh last meeting Apple showed their distaste for ATT in charging their customers for features the iPhone can do but can't on ATT network...while other phones can. ATT with all that money says their network could not handle the high usage iPhone would add...that is the lame excuse to squeeze more money from Apple and the consumers.
And based on your logic I guess Zune was a failure too bec MSFT didn't sell as many music players displite teh fact Zune actually offers you far more for less money. I dont think MSFT Was trying to evenly compete against Apple...they were simply trying their foor in a new market. Windows Mobile is doing well where it has always done well. I dont expect everyday consumers to buy a phone designed for business...again adding to teh popularity of iPhone which I agree when you said that.
However as another person said...you seemed to have a strong opinion as bec a device doesn't sell like iPhone its a failure. Its not...it simply means it the least popular. THis is the first time Apple has released a device that was price similar to others in the same market and as you se they did well. Why can't they do that with the Mac? The biggest downside to Macs is cost...if they costed teh same as a typoical pc which is what they are in a facy case...they would sell 4x as much as they do now. Look at history...in the firts year IBM entered the PC market...they sold 5x's as many computers in the first 3 months then Apple did in a whole year...what a failure for Apple right. I know like pulling the crap out of Steve Jobs @$$ and basking in it as if it was sunlight...but I am sorry...Apple isn't that great...they simply got smarter...however it took 4 decades to get there...wow...how long has MSFT been there?
If MSFt does actually release a phone under their name they potntial will take Apple down. They did it with the PC...they took down Sony with Xbox...wonder whose next?!

[Biggkatt01]

Yeah Sprint is better thats why they have lost 4.6 million customers alone at the end of 2008. People are leaving because nationwide not in any specific area their service sucks period.



Verizon= 82.2 Million subcribers

AT&T= 81.0 Million subscribers

Sprint=49.7 Million subscribers

T Mobile=32.8 Million subscribers

Yeah if Sprint gets 30 Million more customers they will be better, And why do you think customers are leaving Sprint like it's on fire , Because of the service coverage and thhorrible customer service.

[TechieXP]

@RFCEO...I loved the commercial bit.

[davoaxiom]

OK first off how to you quote without having to cut and paste. I'm I missing something cause this is a pain in the ass.
bq.
bq. 1MacGeek - Are you addressing the business practices which are making Apple and the developers a lot of money?
bq.
Did I say developers no I said Apple. Yes Apple locks it's devices into it's programs and it's store, For example try syncing that ipod or iphone with another computer or another program. Apple used to be the little guy on the block that got bullied by the big bad MicroSoft, that's not the case anymore. Apple is the bully that not only controls the MP3 player market but 25% of media sells in the world. As stated before it's not cause iTune is easy to use or the best program but it's because the iDevices are all typed to the program. If you don't believe take a look at the number of iPod and iPhone user that don't own an Apple based PC. I have to say from personal uses of iTunes that the windows version is a bloated, slow loading, slow running piece of crap. Also it's filing system makes WMP look good. Yes I said it. Windows does it better. WMP can sync divices on any number of computers and also allows more control over file because it doesn't hide your media files on the device. With that all said WMP is far from prefect but you can play WMA on other devices and in other programs. Try that with the AAC files.

Apple has time and time again done everything they could to do to not allow hacking of the iWhatever. Making sure that they are locked into the iMonopoly. Apple is also sue happy. Here's a few links about apples business practices:

http://arstechnica.c...sic-players.ars

http://www.tgdaily.c...view/42882/118/

http://www.appleinsi.../09/06/02/applesuedovermethodsforrepeatitunesappstore_sales.html
http://kliv.com/Appl...nteaser/4629277
http://arstechnica.c...nfringement.ars

http://features.csmo...-right-to-know/

Is Apple really doing anything different than a lot of other companies? Yes and no. Apple is really good at finding nitch parts of the market and being miles ahead of the rest of the industry and then market it like crazy. Was apple the first to create a MP3 player? No. Did they build the best one or did the best at marketing thiers? All great but when you get to the point where you control up to 80% of MP3 sales and 25% of music media file sales, you have too much control over the market. This is espeically true if you aggressiely lock your users into your device and store. Yes you can convert AAC to MP3 but let's face it, there is a loss in quality of the files and the average user has no idea how to do it. Thus you have a situation where users are less like to switch devices cause they will loss their library.


bq. I am not sure how this shows anything. Apple has consistently said they came up with the best compromise for maximum battery life, and it would be hard to prove them wrong by their market share. But at the same time they sure don't tell anyone to disable everything that makes an iPhone an iPhone just to use the blessed thing. If one does that, what is the point? And this is precisely my point on the Pre - if you have to quit doing everything in which you perceive the Pre gives value, why have the Pre in the first place?
bq.
Maybe you missed what I stated in the post but I haven't shut anything off. In fact my e-mail to the recieve as quick as possible, I'm also signed into AIM and Gtalk. If you figure there are in the most modest projections around 200,000 units out there, a few hundred posts doesn't mean that everyone is having problems with battery. I've been seeing posts off and on about the same issues with the G3s http://theappleblog....-possible-fix/. Funny but they suggest most of the same fixes. Does that mean that it's also a pile of crap? No but battery problems or not, Pre can talk, chew gum, pat it's head and rub it's stomach. iPhone can't.

The bottom line is that even with the iPhone in it's thrid hardware upgrade is only a little faster than the Pre and still has many of the same limits it had 2 years ago. It's also still tied to the Evil AT&T with no end in sight.

[rfceo]

You know you never said a press release you said games that would work on the Pre. I sent you a link of 93 games that WILL work on the Pre.

[TechieXP]

This has been the most awesome reading ever with Apple fans vs some other product fan. Me myself? I am an IT Desk Support person and I like all things tech related. I have been in so many arguments with Mac fans when it comes to Apple PC vs Windows PC. The problem is this. No matter what facts you present to the as I believe achristie kept repeating, its all suspect even when you give the facts from 3rd parties who have no biased towards a particular company. Its never going to be enough.
Here are some phone facts. The original iPhone also had problems with software fater its release, so did Storm...so did Razr...so have a lot of companys. It happens...you think Disney or Six Flags didn't have problems on the first day. That is technology...even with extensive testing things go wrong. Look at Apple...even with 2 years head start they prove yet again they don't learn from previous mistakes even if it isn't there fault. Apple with all that stock money still couldn't beef up servers to handle activation problems. May they could have if the servers ran Windows instead of OSX. And yes pun was intended. Let's not forget Apple is still in business as it too was a dying breed. Apple for 40 years still don't know how to sell computers...yet brand new companies have all past them up. In fact is Apple even in the top to for PC sales? Even Acer basically a new company compare to Apple is in 4th place.
Apple's fanbase is simple...its a bunch of people who couldn't make a smart decision even if you handed it to them on a olatnuim platter. They are simply a bunch of people stuck in a rut. Example...it is a fact that when Apple introduced teh Mac it was teh best platform at doing desktop publishing, graphics rendering and music and video. Well that is bec there was nothing out there to choose from. Now there is and they are certainly better options under Windows and yet those losers will die buy teh fact and claims Macs still hold an advantage...when they clearly don't. More...? For years Apple fans have stated that Apple has always had the best platfor for and operating system and yet is on their 3rd in 40 years while Windows is on the same platform it started with. Now that Macs are x86 as Windows PC's always have been these same losers feel Macs still have some hardware advantage when it is the same hardware I can go and buy from the store. Apple like Palm was in a death bed and needed a miracle to usurvive...Apple got theirs from the saviour they choose too piss all over MSFT. The 4 best decision Apple made just happen in the past decade or so. #1 bring Steve back to clean up the mess his Pepsi boy messed up...#2 the deal with MSFT which include some IP enfrindgement...however that was a small settlement compared to the 100 million investment MSFT made. If MSFT had pulled Office Apple would have no developers..bec ost were already gone and if MSFT being not only the worlds biggest but alos Apple's biggest...would have sealed Apple's fate if they left. But that would have given MSFT a true monopoly and since the DOJ was all over them as it is...it was in MSFT interest to save their @$$. And it is a matter of fact to this day Apple fans won't except..even tho it is fact.
Apple afterward made some vert intellegent moves including the hype on iPod which turned out to be the 3rd thing that save Apple. The Touch is simply a more ex[ensive iPod and the iPhone is the same...a more expensive Touch. Apple simply evolved teh device that they hyped...and they marketed all 3 very well.
I've read every single comment here and found MacGeek to just be like teh PC fans bois. They have drank so much of Apple's koolaid, that they simply can't think outside the ala cart know as everything Apple. They act like Apple is God's give to technology...however this is on the second time in Apple's history they have had such a huge success....Apple II was teh first...and since Apple sole more Apple II on it release than they did macs, that would mean Macs is a fail product...right MacGeek?
Let's simply give credit where it is due. Apple is doing well great...yes they have set a standard for how good a phone is...however every feature of the iPhone is found ob several phones that existed before iPhone. Apple simply rolled it together very well. Not every touchscreen phone is an iPhone Killer. Sprint learn a huge lesson with Instinct..which I still own and like, but no longer use Sprint bec I hate there CS which is why I left. They stuck me with a bill that was unfairly mine based on poor information given too me by their rep. I left...as my contract has long expired. I never really had trouble with service as I live in Chicago. All of them have great serveice here...but not ATT. Apple went with ATT bec they were the only company that would allow Apple to keep iPhone UI in tact..while Verizon wanted to change it to match them as a carrier...as they do with all phones.
I remember when iPhone brag about the phone beating the Razr. First off they aren't even the same time of phone. They were comparing sales...well the Evo is faster then a Porsche from 0-60, but you don't see Porsche comparing an EVO to their cars...now do you. In all cases when it comes to a phone being the iphone killer...it has been teh media who does this especially when a phone has similar features. However again...the only single feature iPhone had that no other [hone had was full touch capability. However Palm devices did use a pointer for touch...so its not like they didn't have something to go by.
As far as Pre availability...No one has one...especially in huge markets...sure you could possibly go to some hick town out in the middle of nowhere and maybe find a couple...but bigger markets are going to get the biggest supply. That is a fact. So unless you happen to live in this area..ur not getting a Pre.
Apple is so great of a company they they released one of teh most expensive phones to market, yet it was missing half the stuff even cheep prepaid phone have. No copy/paste, no recodng, no mms...no multi-tasking...this coming from a phone that uses a PC operating system. I never heard anyone coplain about multitasking on a Windows Media device.
iPhone is a walking DRM. You can only transfer music/video with a computer that has iTune. What a fluke. So suppose my friend has linux...then what? Oh well. sucks for us. The best thing about other phones...most have removable storage...Apple is teh only company that doesn't off removable storage, replaceable batteries...even some Macs are like that...you can add ram or remove teh batter...yet they are the most expensive computers on the market. Here is a lil history Apple fans...proprietory devices usually don't last very long. Unless it is a device that ppl can deal with. Thus iPhone and iPod are doing ok...but Macs aren't. Again in 10 years Apple has manage to sell only double per its usual. Even Dell in their worse year ever, still sold 3x's as many computers...when they usually sell which is usually 6x's as many.
The only ones 'green' here are Apple fan MacGeek. You really need to stop smoking the leaves of the Apple tree. BTW, did you know that not real weed? Its more like 'grass'. It always seems greener on the other side until you get there and see its only a desert.
As far as stock...I don't trade and yes there were times I wished I jump on Dell and MSFT and even Apple when I had a chance. But stick really doesn't mean much. Dell stock did poorly at times even when teh compay was making billions of dollars. Stocks is simply a bet...its like going out to teh track. Stocks don't make a company successful...WE DO! Stocks don't buy product...WE DO! Stocks don't control how well a company will do...WE DO. if we buy your product...stocks is simply gambling on that buy. No more no less. Its a game just like football. And it also fixed...just like any other sprt can be. Whoever they want to win will..and the ones they don't lose. Simple!
As far as Palm...Unlike Sega who did bet their entire company on a device that did fail...I wouldn't say Palm is doing that just yet. Plam has pulled some miracles before...even in heavy transition. The Treo us the best series they have to date and if they can use what they learned with Pre teh next WebOS phone will be even better. Apple does need to watch them..bec for one..the touch interface on Pre is better..especially at what ppl wanted..MULTITASKING. In 3 updates and 3 phone Apple still can't get there...CAN THEY! OR WILL THEY. Or maybe they don't know how and simply needed another device to copy off of...like OSX copies Windows...or like iPhone stole the look of the LG Prada..or how they seemingly stole a companys touch UI and they are suing Apple over it. Its not like Apple has never stolen an idea be4..right Didn't they steal the GUI for computers from XEROX. We all know the story....right?
As I watch MacGeeks posts I realized that he is smart...he is simply booksmart and not common-sense smart.
Granted again...Apple did set a tone...but not ever phone has to be a touch device to be successful...look at teh BB Curve. OH and get this...EVERYONE WANTS A KEYBOARD IN LANDSCAPE...really? So explain how the top 5 devices that are Smartphones...2 are from RIMM and they don't have a landscape keypad...and yet they are still selling...oh wait even better...Nokia just release a few new phones...wow they look just like the Blackberry...even Motorola has 3 phones at least that look just like the Blackberry...so far only a few company's have pursued the full touch concept. Oh and the best one hasn't attempted it yet...but they do have their own fully touch PC...MSFT. And they could certainly create a better phone than Apple...especially since MSFT has more money then Apple would ever have in 50 lifetimes and MSFT is still growing. Apple hasn't grown in 40 years...
Apple is a hardware company..it is expect they they will make great hardware and they have...but they are certainly not the best...They can innovate other ideas...they like MSFT have no originality. Isn't that what Steve said about MSFT? They have no taste? They have no originality? Name one single product Apple designed from scratch that no one else already had......still waiting.....still waiting...is your head overheating from thinking so much....? Here let me help you...they have none. But yet they rip at MSFT at every turn.
Oh waut more...I jhust got through fighting with this guy about Apple mentioning about pre being Apple to sync with iTunes. Even tho Apple didn't say they would break it...they hinted at the fact bt saying...Itunes is not designed to work with unsupported devices and basically warned that future update could break the ability for other devices to work with iTunes. Last I check they only mention this after the Pre was found to accidentally work He tried to convince me that media sync on iTunes and doesn't work teh same way as it does on other phones....really? I even listed for him the process of how it works. All I got was silence. They ALL work the same....if you want to break it..all you ahve to do is tell the software not to except nothong else. I am betting the next iTunes update will make the Pre break...however I am sure Plam will have their own solution...in fcat it has one...the flash drive shows as a drive letter and anyone that has kept a good library has folders for albums and artists and can simply copy songs back and forth. In fact is it quicker from drive to drive then to have and extra piece of software in the middle. But wait iforgot...Apple has to make it that way bec they must always make money off you. Oh..does iTunes still break when you try to use it to copy a song you rip from a CD with another application? I wouldn't know bec I wouldn't install iTunes on any computer...even a Mac. Oh wait I bought an Air after they drop teh price. The first thing I did? I removed QT and iTunes. Its garbage even on a Mac. And locking their devices to it benefits them nto you. So much for freedom of choice. Oh didn't Steve at MacWorld '97 say that Apple promotes choice? So lets see...can't change to a better battery...who made that choice? Can copy songs unless i use itunes...who made that choice? Man I must was absent from that meeting. When did that all go down...oh iForgot...the public wasn't invite. Pretty much the same move the Federal Reserve did to the USA with our money...right?
Here is some advice...change your home page from Apple.com..and change it to liveurlifemakeurowndecisions.com and see if you fair better. I like SOME Apple products too...but you are being cult...you sound like a the iPhone is an idol hanging on your wall and you worship it at every chance. You should be careful...MacGeek who you call stupid after reading a few thing you said. better to let pppl think you are stupid..then to open your ount and remove all doubt. After being on the outside for 2hours reading and rereading these post I have conclude That Apple has some type of brainwashing app in the Mac and iPhone and once they are bought by the intellectually blind...they are forever at Apple mercy and need the Apple-Seeing Eye Dog for life. These are teh same geeks who only read stories if Apple is somewhere in the title...then the fight is on. The only way you can win is to be like them. The rest of you make very sensible factual, opinionated, common-sense rebuttals that should have made him STFU after the 2nd comment he made. This simply shows how much an effect the media can have on ppl...
Hey MacGeek...I am willing to bet...you actually believe dinosaurs are really 65million years old...that teh water from the flood that never happen was really the Ice Age...Man once swung from trees like Tarzan...and that iPhone is the Messiah in a new form factor...no pun intended on that one and not a hit at anyones religion or beliefs. What is fact and what you believe are not always the same thing...
OH MY GOD teh foold waters are rising...its 4PM CST Time and Plam was at +14.07 and Apple stock went down 0.95. Oh God Apple is dying and Palm is taking over..save all the helpless children in the Apple garden..the flood is coming...
And just one more thing. The Pre is not a fancier version of the Treo...Its a whole new type of phone. Unlike iPhone 3GS which is exactly the same size...same everything except for the CPU and the software to give you features the phone should have had 2 models ago...but yet some still can't be use bec crappy ATT can't handle the load of the phone they wanted so badly. BTW way MacGeek...do u have a girlfriend? If so does she own an iPhone? And if so does she know you love ur phone more than anything in the world? Including human life...even your own life? And have you been drinking the juice out of teh battery in your phone? That isn't Apple Juice by the way..just bec it came out and Apple product and its a liquid....Dude! its a phone...it is not the best phone ever..it is simply the hottest phone today...won't be always...everyone gets a turn. Samsumg has, HTC has, RIM has, Motorola has and Apple has...who is next. Proof has shown that even tho Apple is still having good sales...the market is dropping...and demand is less... especially since Apple didn't even innovate there own phone. The 'S' in 3GS simply means "SAME". Same old Apple - same ole cult...and change ur name from Macgeek to iGeek or similar.

[cyberstven]

I signed up for a stupid PC world account just so I can respond to the idiot who wrote this article and same of the idiots who responded to the article. First off Macgeek, holy crap, don't you have better things to do than respond to people on PC World? Your comments are useless and you aren't getting anywhere. You're telling people to stop smoking weed, but it seems like you are addicted to being on PCworld all day and being douche. You're username is macgeek for god sake... I wonder what someone with a hitlergeek username is saying about world war two. Basically Macgeek, what I am saying is shut up.
Now that I have that out of he way, I think articles such as this one are sick and disgusting. I have been doing research on what phone I was going to get for about a year and a half. To simply say that one phone is better than the other like apple fanboys do is jsut so stupid. I ended up with a pre (for my own reasons), but honestly, I would love to have an iPhone and Android phone as well. They all have their advantages, that's what you people can't understand. To give the Pre bad press for stupid reasons (as in this article), is just so ridicules.. it blows me away. Im also sick of peopele citing RAW NUMBERS to determine the success for the Pre. I like the one user's example of Dell computer sales vs apple computer sales. You can't go off on quantity in a situation like this, especially when there are still waiting lists.
I agree that the iPhone is not as effective in getting people to swtich carriers, but I do not feel that it will harm WebOS in the long run. My girlfriend worked at an apple store for years while in college and was OBSESSED with the first Gen iPhone. Well, she just upgraded to the 3GS and after she played with it for 10 minutes, she gave me a sad face and said I want your phone. I showed her an article of the future WebOS device (Eos) possibly coming to ATT and she said if it is truly coming out, she will sell her 3GS (to some dipst like Macgeek) and get that phone. So what I am trying to say is that if/ when palm offers Web0S on multiple carriers, interest will boom. The lack of apps isn't a big deal to everyone... out of all those applications on the iphone, i think there are maybe 5 I would use every day. Yes, my pre doesn't have those apps yet, but being able to play the ocarina isn't going to detract me from getting a phone.
And last, I'm sick of hearing about Sprint's service. ATT sucks just as much, if not more. First off, EVERY friend of mine who has the iPhone admits that their service/ call quality is terrible (they defend the phone to the death, but at least they admit that). So please, don't tell me ATT is that much better (it def isnt 40% extra in monthly fees better).
So please apple fan boys, stop trying to give bad press to a phone that is very comparable but different. Maybe if the Pre does well, Apple will start giving us bigger upgrades than adding a letter at the end. Oh and Mr Coursey, congrats on 20 people choosing "yes" for recommending this article (15 of which were macgeek). Keep up the good work trying to destroy anything that isnt apple.

[cyberstven]

Made a mistake,
I agree that the PRE is not as effective in getting people to swtich carriers, but I do not feel that it will harm WebOS in the long run.

[Biggkatt01]

when it comes to computers i have only purchased Windows systems, But that is in the past I will never buy another Windows computer never again I will either get a system running Linux or An Apple system, But that is another dog alltogether.

Ok you are right the Iphone did have minor problems. But it was nothing full blown as the Pre, and Apple acknowledged the problem and promptly fixed the problem.

Like I said the difference here is like I said Iphone buyers didn't have to go crazy to get the Iphone issue fixed,and as far as the activation problem goes when you activate that many phones that no other company has done before you are gunna have glitches and I can say as a fact if they had of been using a Windows system there would have been no activations because the system would have been down because of a virus or some sort of instability issue. hence the reason Vista was a failure.

As I said before yes I don't like the phone, anytime a phone comes out and you have to turn everthing off for it to get good battery life than it's a piece of and that's just reality.

The fix that was given to Palm Pre users was to turn off certain features of the phone to get good battery life. And every feature that Palm Pre users are trying to gloat about can already be done on an Iphone except for Multi tasking and that dog can stay in the kennel until the battery drain it causes can be addressed.

All the other things i can do with my Iphone, My phone is jailbroken and the apps for the phone once jailbroken reaches at minimum 60,000 apps and the develepers that bring the apps to the Iphone are die hard fans.

Can you show me a jailbroken Pre no and no one is trying because its not worth it. Shoot an email over to the Iphone dev team and say can you work on jailbreaking the Palm Pre for us and they will laugh and not respond.

It makes no difference who has the Iphone, It just makes me laugh that Verizon and Sprint and some of you Pre owners talk about Apple and the Iphone, But Verizon and Sprint to keep asking Apple when will we get it we can give you a better deal than AT&T.

And if the Iphone had have come out for Verizon or Sprint we wouldn't be having this discusion so vigurously, Were having this conversation because it is only on AT&T and there's anger at that.

So everytime I see one of these so called Iphone killers come out from Verizon and Sprint And T mobile I laugh because there talkin this but as soon s Apple says ok you can have it to, then they will shut the hell up.

So lets count the casualties in this war.

1)Lg Voyager=Verizon just hype not popular

2)Samsung Instinct=Sprint just hype not popular

3)Blackberry Storm=Verizon just hype not popular, giving them away to get money on Blackberry plans

4)Palm Pre=Sprint ? Time will tell

T mobile's G1 isn't on the list because it's a popular phone and it works and people like it.

[Biggkatt01]

You won't use all those apps because your just a for fun user so just go and play with your lil Pre and leave the grown people talk to us.

Cancel your account after reading this please

[cyberstven]

Hey Big Katt,

Again, the problem with this world is that they do not get their facts straight. Read on pre forums for 5 mintues and you will see there are people already working on jailbreaking the pre and they have already been able to add apps without jailbreaking it. You people drive me crazy giving out false information.