[splwrx]

Guys, lets keep this simple, starting on the Wii, i have had 2, why did i buy 2 you may ask... well, the first time i was intrigued, got it and played Wii Sports, and this Red Sword or something-a-rather game. Wii sports was unreal, i'd never had 4 people in the living room constantly wanting to play tennis, bowling etc... everyday almost. but to play red sword (if i named it wrong, i dont really care. lol.) and other first person games was beyond a joke, horribly low resolution, crappy lagged slicing and dicing, doesnt always do exactly what its meant to do. i then sold it. a $400AUD product just for bowling, was a luxury i could do without. 2 years later, just 2 months ago, i decided to buy another one, and yes, thats right, still $400AUD even today. played Wii sports, as this time round i was convinced its still all its good for, but ill be entertained. i was wrong, the Wii console is also good for mario bros games. cool. had enough after 1 week, and returned it to the store for a full refund. still a waste of money, but great concept for children using the Wii on a CRT, not a flat screen where the Wii remote can go through the panel and then cost much more than $400AUD.lol.

XBox 360, own one, and wont live without one, but, in saying that this is another peice of garbish that MS simply doesnt care to improve upon when they know a Manufacturer defect within the product is clearly present, but replacing the internals with tried and tested solutions is also too hard. even the new revisions with onboard HDMI, still get 3 red rings. what the hell, MS, this is not good practice, this only proves you have monkeys in your R&D dept. other than this, playing games on the xbox is easy, as its meant to be just like on a PS3, or PS2, or original XBOX. press a button, and the game responds in kind. but, the drawback is that games for the 360 and PS3 have gotten as good as they can for visual quality and performance, the games already utilize 100% of the systems abilities, so where else is there to go now, keep making games for these consoles as best you can, and people will still be happy, yes this is true, but only for so long.
PS4, and Xbox 720 (if thats to be their names) should be systems with upgradable functionality, like a notebook. increase ram, the non-onboard graphics card to be upgradable, and the sky is the limit, doing this will increase the lifespan of any one console, and allow gameplay to improve on them. dont do this, and we will all be stuck in the same dorment 5yr cycle as we're currently in.

PC, well this is a simple proposition, although piracy is easier for pc games, than consoles, this doesnt mean you can always play those games. lol. many occasions a downloaded game just wont work, buy the game, and it does, why, well even following the crack steps, and making the game load, doesnt take into account all the other variables of your individual machine, and how it operates. this pains me. immensly.
in saying that though, id happily go out and buy PC games over console games for 2 reasons, 1, they are ALWAYS cheaper, even when buying the Collectors or Special Edition versions, when comparing to console games. and 2, becuase you can improve the quality of how the system operates whilst playing these games. Games for Windows is a joke, yes, because it signifies nothing, and only helps protect piracy, but as many of us already know, Securom has been cracked. so now what MS??? how about making Games for Windows what its meant to be, full integration with the XBOX 360 wired or wireless controller, and Windows Live provided game patches as they become available, to those who say this happens already, it very well may, but not always, GTA4 has a patch out 3 weeks ago, but games for windows didnt tell me bout it, Google Search did.

so guys, your all whining about pc's being more expensive and costing thousands, yeah it would if you go and buy a liquid cooling, air fighter jet chassis, with bells, whistles and all the other rubbish that does nothing to improve your pc other than aesthetically. then yes, its gonna cost lots. but if your smart, a good enough game pc should cost overall at least $800AUD, thats a bit more than the PS3 40GB @ $699AUD, but how much more is this machine going to do compared to a PS3. EVERYTHING will be MORE, EVERYTHING will be BETTER on the PC. for $800AUD!!!!

if it came down to MS picking between, PC and Console, the obvious choice is PC, as we could all do without a xbox if the PC would play games without installation being required.

so go out and buy a console if if you dont have patience, or if you do, you'd be better off with a PC

[splwrx]

Heres another Epic David and Goliath (Console vs PC) argument. lets be honest here, a console is an older style pc in most cases (with the exception of the PS3 internals), when released to market, you can build the same or better spec pc for less than the cost of those out-dated spec consoles. whats more, even if a console has more efficiency and simplicity, it doesnt automatically mean longevity.

i have an Xbox 360, a PS3, a PS2, and i HAD 2 Wii's in my lifetime. i also run a server at home as my media centre, to play games, a one time purchase of a good video card will suffice. all of these consoles are great fun to play Rainbow Six, Gran Turismo etc....., but the Wii, as fun as it is, i couldnt tolerate how rubbish it actually is.

i will still buy consoles, why, simple, becuase you put the disc in the drive, and the game plays flawlessly everytime, until on a 360 you get 3 red rings. (JOY!!!). if you are like me and lucky enough to have this happen to you 4 times on the same console, you'd be pretty peeved. Microsoft has never been good with hardware, it took 10+ years for their keyboards and mice to function better than logitechs, and thats only on Vista machines from my experience.

the Wii console, a travesty. resolution on HD monitors cant be greater than 640x480, in 2008, this is not good marketing, in fact its stupid, but i do see the relevance to it. firstly the WII is basically only good for interactive style activities, such as golf, bowling, swimming, fishing, and any other activity or sports based games. but to expect a WII console to play serious games, such as driving sims, RPG, and strategy games, well.... if you buy one for those reasons, its a good waste of money. the Wii controller as good as its meant to be, is simply a wireless presenter, and i think you will find a logitech wireless presenter mouse, or similar on a PC will function on screen the same way. the motion sensors are nice and provide more moevment on the Wii, but all this can be easily replicated to other consoles or PC's.

my verdict, a console is cheaper than a PC, a Wii is good for activities you normally had to go to a venue to enjoy, such as golf, bowling, tennis etc.. a PC can be all you need it to be, no limitations exist. EVER! the xbox 360 controller works with some games automatically, whilst MS games for WIndows is a load of crap and represents almost nothing of use, some games are best left to keyboard, but its still wise to have options, which most if not all games will have.

to comment on resolutions of 3840x2400. that would be nice, but totally silly and unneccessary, unless flying aircraft in flight sims etc.. more to the point, find me a 1080P LCD or Plasma TV that can run this resolution, then find me a video card that will run at that res and not drop below the 25fps per second average for current popular and heavy games, such as GTA4 or COD WoW. today, not gonna happen, tomorrow who knows, but its still overkill. consoles will stay at 1080p, even the PS3 and 360 replacements. why, becuase tv's dont exist to run higher res than that, and even if they do, whats the point, the human eye wouldnt see the improvement, other than how much smaller everything is. i love my HD, but doubling the current 1080p standard really.... Why???

[MysteriouX]

There is one thing that's nice about the Xbox and PC though, Microsoft has made it possible for PC owners to create their own games in languages such as C#, VB.Net, VC.Net using Visual Studio/XNA. It's the same code/script whether you write the game for the PC or the Xbox, all that needs to be done is building it for the console you want to play it on.

(Downside: Xbox live subscription is required to export the game you wrote on the PC to your Xbox.)

If only future Playstations, Nintendos, other consoles or handhelds allowed you to do this just as easily it would be great.

[Monster78]

Relax dude. Yes it’s true Mouse and Keyboard do beat
Gamepads hands down (pardon the pun). You can’t get more precision then a mouse especially
compared to some Gamepad on a console which you can’t even customize most of
the time or have a few preset buttons that you have to abide by. No thanks I’ll
stick with my Keyboard and mouse you have fun on your already outdated console
with your 60 dollar a pop joysticks. O yeah, you can actually buy joystick for
the PC, there’s even an Xbox 360 joystick for the PC maybe you missed that
part.

[steve19970]

An interesting list. As both a PC gamer and a Console Gamer, I see a few problems with your list.

1. PCs are scalable.

That's definitely true. If you want to play Crysis, for example, you can go spend several hundred (or thousand) dollars getting your rig in shape to play it. More power to you. As stated by an earlier commenter, however, I do enjoy going to the store, buying an Xbox 360 game, and knowing that it will actually work in my system when I get it home, without heavily scrutinizing the system requirements. I see this as a strength of the console.

2. PC games are endlessly manipulable.

Point for PC. WoW mods very much change the game, for example.

3. PCs ape consoles in emulation.

OK great...NES games can be found legally, and I'm certain that I've played Oregon Trail a few times for free (Spiderman has died of dysentery). Anything else? I'm pretty sure that MAME emulators are available for the PS3 and Wii, so I think the PC's advantage has eroded. Additionally, I can play quite a few old favorites on the Xbox Live Arcade and the Wii Virtual Console, several with updated HD graphics (try Super Street Fighter II HD Remix...awesome!) and completely legit. Tie.

4. PCs can be anywhere.

True. Xboxes can be hooked up to VGA monitors, so you can play them in your dorm room. As a gaming console, I'm not seeing a huge advantage here. Tie.

5. Keyboard and mouse beats all.

I'm having a hard time beating this argument (I've been a mouser since the Quake days), except that Guitar Hero for PC hasn't been flying off the shelves. Advantage: PC.

6. PCs do gamepads, surprise!

So you're saying that an advantage of the PC is that it can emulate a console? How nice. Advantage: Console.

7. Consoles go kaplooey, too.

PCs suck less? Fail. Tie.

8. Consoles could vanish tomorrow, but PC gaming is forever.

Your reasoning is tough to read at best, but I get what you're trying to say. I game with my PC on the road because I haven't brought my Xbox. Advantage: PC. On another tangent, if I have my DS with me along with my laptop, which will I play on a plane/in a car/etc. The DS, because it is designed to be portable.

9. PC games are stylistically unbounded.

Go take a look at Halo Wars, and let me know. The reason that some styles of games are produced only for PC is that PC can sustain the niche market, as the console development overhead is higher. Anyone can put up a website where you can download their game. XNA Community is closing the gap here. Advantage: PC

10. PCs are the creative heart of video gaming.

Agreed. Advantage: PC

11. PC games cost less.

True, but upgrading your computer to keep up with the requirements of the newest PC games could cost you more than that.

12. Online PC matchmaking is free.

True.

13. Piracy ain't just a PC problem.

Again, PC sucks less? Nope...PC sucks more. Nice try. Advantage: consoles.

14. PCs excel at family-hotseat-group-play, too.

Unless your PC is in your living room already, hooked up to your TV, PC loses this one bigtime. "Let's all huddle around your PC" is losing to Rock Band.

15. PC display screens trump living room TVs.

Didn't you say that a PC's strength is that it can be hooked up to a TV in #4? Weird contradiction. I agree with you, but...weird.



All in all, I think that, had you done a list of 10 (or 5), it would have been a much stronger set of arguments. Since you diluted your arguments with some questionable logic and some real stretches, I felt compelled to sign up and comment.

[coastie65]

Not Bad. I do have a problem with #1 though. I can play Crysis quite well on this thing, and it didn't take a whole lot. You don't need a super duper high end gaming machine to play the stuff that is being released. You do need something a bit above the entry level machine though. Over all the post was prtty sound though. coastie65

[splwrx]

i agree with your re-assessment. PC's are scalable, anything is achievable, but the downside once again is buying a PC game, and expecting it to work flawlessly, which in some cases, it doesnt. again this always depends on the users config and data profile, but it shouldnt be. going back to my original post, a console is simple. buy a game, put it in the ODD, and it loads without install, without delays, or cyclic memory issues. if all a console was meant to do is take PC games and gaurantee they allow playability, then a console wins hands down. but i am still quite happy to tweak, and tune any game installed to run better, or to make it work.

i would love to see Games for Windows force PC Games and Optical Drives to work in unisin, to operate the same way as a console, put the disc in, the game loads without requiring install. maybe a small install of 50mb for process and online connection tools. i know this is possible, but will it be done??? who knows. but if it does happen, it will be end of consoles, or at least from Microsoft anyway.

[JimH443]

h1. The Single Reason PC Gaming is in Last Place
1. Selection. Walk into any game store, such as GameSpot, and take a look at the games that are available. PS2, PS2, Wii, GameCube, XBox... all these have a wider selection of games available. The PC games will be found either in the back corner or in the discount bin.



If I were to add a second reason, it would be:

2. Tradability. Some stores encourage returning used games for nominal credit to the customer and markup / resale (as used) by the store. This is something that PC games don't and probably never will.

[splwrx]

that is 100% true, although gaming stores sell PC games, they only stock so many of one title, and flood the shelves at the rear of the store. this is comoon place, and unforutnate but its mainly due to marketing. if Microsoft start going nuts with marketing "Games For Windows" via TV and radio campaigns, much like witht eh Xbox, im sure there will be an increase in expsoure, and maybe push the items closer to the front of the store. yeah EB Games do provide a ruetnr/exchange program in OZ too, buy a console game for $99.95AUD, cash it in for $40, or get $55 credit towards another title. they resell that game later for $79.95. becuase PC games use a serial key, stores would never accept a PC game back purely for this reason, even if the product is still in shrink-wrap. this could change, but who knows if it ever will. again, it goes back to my first comment, make PC games load without install. that would solve many problems.

[Liamm]

Some of your Reasons are downright wrong. particularly 7 and 11 see my counter list



http://www.liamm.com...lling-pc-gaming

[mcbarker]

This flowchart makes choosing easier... B-)

[psynophile]

Had to sign in for this one. 10 reasons PC Gaming sucks.
1) CRT/LCD screens on computers suck . I didn't spend X000.00 on my LCD/Plasma to NOT play games on it.
2) 1000.00's of dollars on computer hardware that will cost a third or less in a year is pathetic.
3) Too many BS technologies. Well, they're not BS in and of themselves, I just don't have time to care about them all. Who cares about 154xAA. I'll withstand a slight difference in detail if I don't have to fiddle with all of that crap.
4) Emulators? Whatever. Everyone always goes on and on about emulators. Sorry, but I'm old enough to have played the old games through more than once, on the original consoles, and on emulators. Emulators never work 100% correctly.
5) I have to install how many things just to get this to work? DirectX what? OpenGL what? Steam what? Incompatible drivers? HDCP? I don't give a crap. I want to play the freaking game!
6) qwertyuiop[]asdfghjkl;'xzzcnm,./ How many button's do I need to remember to play this game? 105? 120? I need a quick guide just for the buttons? Yea, that's totally rad. Not.
7) Keyboards are good for typing. TYPING. Holding control to crouch for long periods of time with my pinky? Forget that crap...
8) Sales. Biggest selling game of 2006 for PC? World of Warcraft. The rest? The Sims. The third most sold game sold less than a million copies. Halo 3? 6 million? 8 million? Aren't you tired of playing with bots?
9) Separation and loneliness. I can go from watching a movie with my buddies, to playing L4D with a click of the button. To play together with PC's, we all have to either lug around 50 pieces of hardware or go back to our respective places and log in to our computers.
10) Quality of games. Every decent game that's come out for PC has been on console. The PC players are pretty much the sad kids that are in the corner playing with themselves trying to find a way to justify their expensive hardware. Get real man.
Look, I started playing games in the mid 80's. I've been through consoles since Atari and PC games since config.sys and King's Quest. It's over, man. Shed a tear and get on with your gaming on a console. The only games left for PC's exclusively suck (Crysis), and the ones that don't aren't called games, they're called social networking now...

[MysteriouX]

We're all forgetting 1 simple thing.



Xbox 360, 720, or PS3, PS3 MKII, or any uber PC..... who cares. When the holodeck from Star Trek becomes reality, it will blow them all away as the ultimate gaming machine.

[Kmach]

1. Keeping your PC up to date with the current gaming software is just way too pricey for me and I'm guessing most casual gamers. No one wants to spend the time with requirements, updates, installs, etc., people just want to pop a game in a play.
2. Let's face it, it is 2009 but most people still keep their computers in a seperate room. One of the big draws of console gaming besides the price is that my friends and I can all sit on the couch in the living room, play games, and hang out. Sure you can do that with a PC but you would have to have enough ports, purchase multiple controllers, and have a local multiplayer compatible game. Yes, that's a lot more cash to spend on your $2000 PC just to get a similar experience to the X360 and/or PS3. Sorry but due to the graphics and very limited online compatibility I am not even going to include the Wii in this discussion, we are talking about next gen gaming.
3. PC games are a LITTLE cheaper and yes some are free, but many of the PC online titles require a monthly fee which means after paying for just one game (Warcraft, etc) you are already paying the same amount of money as Xbox Live, a service which gives you online multiplayer access to hundreds of the newest games, movie content, etc.
4. The mouse and keyboard offer no type of feedback like console controllers. I know this will upset some but IN MY PERSONAL OPINION the key/mouse setup reduces fps titles to a simple point and click. Don't get me wrong, everyone should have a PC for online/home functions but for gaming it is just not the way to go for most gamers. Some genres work great on PC's such as RPG's and RTS's. Emulation is also a bonus for some. However, most people are looking for a more streamlined, simple, and cheaper machine to play the latest games on.

[philmatar]

I do not agree. Console gaming experience is far ahead of the PC.

- You just turn on the console, wait for a few seconds and start playing immediately. No need to boot up windows, no unexpected slowdowns from background tasks, no windows update popup that breaks your game.

- When installing a new game no need to spend time tweaking zillions of graphics options like resolution, frame rate, 3D features, anti aliasing etc to get a respectable framerate. No need to change and update graphics drivers in order to solve a crash with one game and break another one.

In fact my ps3 games just run perfectly: I install the game and start playing. The game has been prepackaged and configured to run under one single platform smoothly and reliably while with the PC there is an infinite number of configurations that game developers need to consider - and often you will spend appreciable time doing configuration work and updating drivers.

Sitting in the living room with a wireless controller adapted for gaming on a big HD LCD is much better than being glued to a computer LCD and keyboard.

One area where the PC gaming experience is still superior (because the keyboard rules) are strategy games like red alert, civ etc. Otherwise the console is just more fun and more easily accessible.

[dpaterso]

i disagree with you completely. he isnt talking about realism, and the wii remote is intuitive for a few select situations, otherwise, it is a badly designed brick. do you own a wii? a large number of games dont even make use of the motion sensing technology and it is bacially a terribly uncomfortable nintento paddle from 1989. what hes talking about here is playability. you can play ANY game of any genre effectively with a keyboard and mouse. hes not tlaking about realism one bit.
my point is, that he is 100% correct, keyboard and mouse trump all other user Input Devices. try playing a FPS with a xbox controller against someone playing with a keyboard and mouse. assuming you are both equally skilled, i doubt the xbox player would even be able to get close to a kill before he was cut down by the mouse aimer. same with real time startegy, you just wouldnt be able to control your units with anywhere near the prceision with a controller compared to controller.

the only games where you would have any kind of distinct advantage would be the couple fo games for wii that nintendo themselves made, namely wii sports. but these are very specific games designed around the controller. and i bet you could do just fine with a mouse

[coastie65]

JimH443 said:

h1. The Single Reason PC Gaming is in Last Place
1. Selection. Walk into any game store, such as GameSpot, and take a look at the games that are available. PS2, PS2, Wii, GameCube, XBox... all these have a wider selection of games available. The PC games will be found either in the back corner or in the discount bin.





If I were to add a second reason, it would be:


2. Tradability. Some stores encourage returning used games for nominal credit to the customer and markup / resale (as used) by the store. This is something that PC games don't and probably never will.

As far as tradability goes, I did take some PC games to EB Games. I think it was 5 games for a total of $3.25. Not worth it. I'll just give them away to whoever wants them. coastie

[mattpeckham]

coastie65 said:

As far as tradability goes, I did take some PC games to EB Games. I think it was 5 games for a total of $3.25. Not worth it. I'll just give them away to whoever wants them. coastie

Interesting, I didn't realize EB took PC games in trade these days.

[mcbarker]

They (EB) stopped doing that here years ago. They were getting a lot of returns and ticked off customers, because if the game required the user to register online (as some do) after installation, they found that they couldn't activate it, because their copy had already been registered to the previous owner.

[coastie65]

[quote name='mattpeckham']
>

coastie65 said:

>
> As far as tradability goes, I did take some PC games to EB Games. I think it was 5 games for a total of $3.25. Not worth it. I'll just give them away to whoever wants them. coastieInteresting, I didn't realize EB took PC games in trade these days.

Hey Matt, This was in June 2005 and after that I decided it wasn't worth it, so they may not now. The EB games in this area are now GameStop and I have seen used PC games on the shelf that have to come from somewhere. coastie