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Protecting Against the Rampant Conficker Worm

#61 User is offline   CAT5E Icon

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Posted 31 March 2009 - 05:19 AM

Great thought to switch O/S es , however............

If anyone who is running a Full Licensed version of Microsoft O/S is not interested in burning a budget and pay their IT person to spend so many days in putting in computers in Apple maybe the worker is comfortable with Microsoft, and additional money being spent to be trained in running a Mac ( no insult intended but a logical standpoint ) .

Employers with a limited IT budget in this economy want concrete answers with NO nonsense answers, this is really a simple process and only the people running illegal software will smack into a wall if they have not yet already done so.
# Make sure your copy of Windows is legal.

# Have the current updates of the patches downloaded.

# Purchase a legitimate Security Suite software, buy all the licenses that the company has for each machine, your IT person, security consultant who knows how to do this.

# Run virus scans on all machines.

# Have your IT person educate as well have a written policy on surfing the net , using company emails for non-business purposes.

# The security software as well the O/S software UP TO DATE !
# The Network firewall can be software or hardware, it depends on your situation, and budget.
Linux is a good O/S and is Open Source, however a fully trained IT person that is certified and /or possess a degree in IT that can investigate and give a report on what needs to be done in order to properly switch over, making sure LINUX drivers, and any patches are available, you may find a item such as a printer may not have the proper drivers, then you may want to investigate into replacing that printer or just leave it set up on your server if someone is using a windows O/S. of course again you have to draw up planning.

Now you ask about me and what do I know. Answer is simple, I am a Soon to graduate Student in Information Technology Management , Associate membership with IEEE, Assoc. Membership with ISCET, I am not here to promote or demote if you will any product. I do strongly advise stay away from these so called security scans for free , they will stop and ask you to buy their product. I am aware of some that you try to delete it seems that they tend to reinstall themselves and are as bad as a virus or a worm itself. some are really a scam. buy from a reputable site.
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#62 User is online   WinTard Icon

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Posted 31 March 2009 - 08:00 AM

Since we are getting close to the April 1st, 2009 {April Fool's Day} and there appears to be multiple threads about this Conficker/Downadup worm on PCWorld, I am simply cut-and-pasting the latest info to all relevant threads. Also, the latest article only returns a blank page since March 30th, one can only presume the article ran 'dead' for some reason or another?

Quote



WinTard wrote:

1.|m-202642] Mar 31, 2009 7:50 AM [1.|m-202545] in response to: [PCWorld|m-202545] Re: [What You Need to Know About the Conficker Worm


Not another one of those... Anyway wow, great, the page comes up empty. Both in FF 3.0.8 and IE 8. Wonder why? Technical problems I suppose... Well, I say to Conficker/Downadup: Bring it on! Anybody fully patched, with up-to-date Anti-Virus, and using the LUA principle, doesn't have to worry about a thing. Others operating as root super-user admin, well, who knows? But facts show this worm got to the 10+ million infection mark within two weeks of its appearance. Then simply stalled and became impotent. Further numbers revealed the disinfection took down the numbers to somewhere in the 200K range. But we keep on hearing of its existence, and of course the infamous April 1st timebomb date... Some worm in the spotlight? Don't worms dry up and die when uncovered? We'll know tomorrow! Soon enough? I reiterate Bring It ON! I say Y2K. Oh and thanks for the article. In all fairness, probably still being worked upon, and picked-up by bots generating for the forums?

In summary here's what you need to pay attention to: (As simple as 1-2-3)
1) Ensure you have all the latest patches for Conficker/Downadup from Microsoft. The simplest is to enable auto-update. The current patch is MS08-067. For more detailed info, I highly recommend reading the following:
* http://www.microsoft...conficker.mspx]

> * [http://blogs.technet.com/mmpc/archive/2009/01/22/centralized-information-about-the-conficker-worm.aspx]
> * [https://forums2.symantec.com/t5/blogs/blogarticlepage/blog-id/malicious_code/article-id/228]
> 2) Consider never using the Administrator equivalent account for normal day-to-day activities. Thus implementing the Least User Access ([LUA) principle. Here's how to:

Quote


> >
> > I agree that a freshly loaded pristine installation of Windows works like greased lightning, until bloatware, starts perverting it...
> >
> > As an example, on an old P4 with 1GB RAM (Dell Dimension 4600) a clean install of Windows XP SP3 (with all security fixes as of 2009.02.10
> > Microsoft Security Bulletin) boots in 21 seconds to the login prompt. And uses only 116 MB RAM !
> >
> > Now they don't even sell Intel P4's anymore, that is a dinosaur!
> >
> > As for the Least User Privilege principle, here is a good thread to consider for anyone interested in running Windows like Unix, using normal (non-administrative) user accounts for day-to-day stuff, while not having to logoff / logon as 'root' to perform administrative duties by using the Run As command like su in Unix:
> >
> > I reiterate, that Windows is very Unix Like...
> >
> > And I found a good tutorial for the Run As command from The University of Michigan IT Security Services:
> > > Excerpt from: [http://safecomputing.umich.edu/events/download/RunAsUsersumit05.pdf]
> > >
> > > Run As User
> > >
> > > You’ve heard it a thousand times: “Don’t run as admin”. Yet you continue to tempt fate. You log in with admin credentials and surf the wild wild web through whatever minefield it takes you. You open email and attachments with abandon, confident in the fact that you’ve never been hacked before. Yet every once in a while, your heart starts to beat a little faster. Perhaps it happens when you land on some web site you didn’t expect, or when you double?click on that unsolicited email or launch some video clip that your friend sent you. Your heart accelerates because you know, deep down, it’s just a matter of time before you do get hacked. And then, because you’re logged in with administrative credentials, you know the price could be big. If you’re lucky, only your ego will be bruised. Worse, the integrity of your system will be compromised and personal as well as private University information will belong to someone else. In fact, it’s entirely feasible that your system has already been compromised and you’re not even aware of it. How do you know that it hasn’t?
> > >
> > > If you’re pushing your luck by logging in with administrative credentials, then read this paper. We’ll illuminate the “tips and tricks” necessary to start running as user. You’ll feel better running in a less privileged context, and you’ll be making a critical
> > > contribution to the security posture of your unit and the University.
> > >
> > > {Snipped}
> > >

> > 3) Sit back, relax and enjoy the [Blinkenlights 101
...
[quote]>
> Has anybody tried to advance their system clock to April 1st? Just for fun? I have. So? What an anti-climactic moment...
>
> Relax, Enjoy, just watch where you step...
>
> PS: I've yet to see one single instance of this much advertised worm... Anywhere?
> PPS: Funny this article comes from MacWorld... I thought this Conficker affects PC Windows? Not OS X? Oh you mean Boot Camp, I see...
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~
> Un homme avertit en vaut deux
> {Proverbe Français}
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#63 User is offline   eot8857 Icon

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Posted 31 March 2009 - 09:34 AM

I agree that the partisan attitude is counter-productive. I am always amazed at the feeling of invulnerability that users feel with their respective OSes. I use all 3 platforms in my daily work (Windows, Mac, Linux), due to their respective areas of strength. For every positive thing you can say about an OS, there is at least one thing you can say negative about it.

People should always remember their history, as well - the first successful virus ever created was the Creeper virus, which affected computers running TENEX (forerunner of UNIX) on ARPANET. Yes, the UNIX family was vulnerable at one time of its early life. Apple wins the award for the first virus to escape from the testing lab and spread. "The Rother J" virus infected Apple floppy disks like mad, back in the day.

No computer or OS is 100% protected. The people who said "Macs don't get viruses" are either fooling themselves or uninformed. Macs were hit with OSX/Inqtana.A and Oompa-Loompa under Tiger; it's only a matter of time until Leopard comes under attack. UNIX admins can also tell you all about the Slapper worm, which wasn't too terribly long ago.

True, these systems are less likely to simply acquire a virus, but the single biggest security risk on a computer is the user. Trojans can cause as much damage as a common virus/worm, and every platform is at risk from uninformed (or new) users. These are the users who are simply amazed (and chagrined) at how easily I can get into their machine using "single user mode". They are generally technical enough to talk about certain things, but not enough to know how to button down their own machine.

Mac users are especially deflated when I demonstrate that anyone with a retail DVD of OS X can boot off of it to change the admin password. 5 minutes per machine in an average Mac-based computer lab would be all someone would need to inject a trojan.

No matter how complicated you make the lock on a door, you have to remember that its function is to grant access. If you're smart enough to create it, there is always someone smart enough to pick the lock.
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#64 User is online   WinTard Icon

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Posted 31 March 2009 - 10:13 AM

Welcome CAT5E and eot8857 to our wonderful PCWorld community of enthusiasts! I hope you will find your stay with us enjoyable, informative and fun. Thank you so much for sharing with us your knowledge and experience. I 100% concur with your statements, and it is a breath of fresh air, to bump into other knowledgeable members of your caliber. Please continue to educate us with your wisdom. We're all students of life here. You both are gentlemen, and scholars.

My respects eot8857 and CAT5E ! :)

~~~~~~~~~~
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#65 User is offline   apexwebmaster Icon

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Posted 31 March 2009 - 10:53 AM

I checked those queries and yes the numbers are quite high for Linux opposed to Windows. However, keep in mind that discussion for any open source software will probably be quite high all over, in newsgroups, BBS's, etc. It's open source, so discussion is also open. With Windows, it is closed source so discussion will be open for 3rd parties, but probably closed to/from Microsoft itself. I didn't do much further looking but this is a broad assumption to account for some of those numbers.

Pwn2Own 2009 is definitely an interesting subject. I would have been very interested to see how quickly they would have been able to hack the Linux box. Mac OS X is based on FreeBSD, which is not Linux. It is similar in many ways, but some essential services and components are different. So it's hard to say if one was hacked, if the other would be. I am definitely not disagreeing that there are vulnerabilities as there always will be in any OS. But I can tell you that I'm a lot more laid back on a Linux system than I am on a Windows system.

As to this article, I haven't read that by installing the patch from Microsoft that the system is completely safe. From what I've seen (correct me if I'm wrong), Conficker can still travel by flash drives and removable media. Everybody suggests to disable autorun for removable media and update the virus definitions. So essentially you're turning off a setting that is on by default for convenience. So I don't think I'd get too relaxed on this one just yet for those using Windows. Even if your definitions are up to date, there's still a chance that you could be come infected then have to clean up the mess later.
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#66 User is offline   TechieXP Icon

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Posted 31 March 2009 - 11:26 AM

I second that welcome and I definitely concur with your statements especially this one "No matter how complicated you make the lock on a door, you have to remember that its function is to grant access. If you're smart enough to create it, there is always someone smart enough to pick the lock."

One of the most fancy devices I remember of late was Lojack. It was a very good concept...but what good is it if the person steals ur car while you're sleep and by teh time it is found its already stripped? Almost like how some viruses work in computers and in humans.

Immunization is how human protect themselves against many ailments. However I never understood the benefit of the flu shot. Yet the people who get them still get the flu?

Did you Mac fans see what he said? Did the Linux fans see what he said? And us Windows fans...well we already know.
April fools day possible virus released? I think its just a media scare...however any SMART person will either get protection or shut off the PC tomorrow.

Just remember, no matter how much you pawn off that no platform is safe - if a person believes otherwise they won't believe until they suffer. However whether they admit they suffered is another story in itself.

Hope we see more from you on similar subjects. Maybe if enough of us explain the facts, maybe those who don't believe will listen.
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#67 User is online   WinTard Icon

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Posted 31 March 2009 - 01:52 PM

Hello apexwebmaster, you and I think alike. I salute you sir. Please don't get me wrong, I am not anti-Linux or anti-anything. I am merely pointing out that a false sense of security is at the root cause of um, trouble, unanticipated troubles, let's say. I'd also like to point out that the Google search algorithms are a gem, pure genius! Not at all the simple linear search, matching by character or string, but with a lot more heuristics, refinements and precise acumen included. Thus as an example, if we search:
Results 1 - 10 of about 419,000,000 for linux [definition]. (0.23 seconds)
versus
Results 1 - 10 of about 2,440,000 for linux vulnerabilities. (0.27 seconds)
Google understands the meaning of what we're looking for.
So the general discussions going on about open-source Linux issues are not at all the same if we include the term 'vulnerabilities' along with it...
Similarly:
Results 1 - 10 of about 157,000,000 for windows [definition]. (0.22 seconds)
versus
Results 1 - 10 of about 326,000 for windows vulnerabilities. (0.18 seconds)
are specific, and somewhat representative, at least in perspective to what we're looking for.

Now that doesn't mean necessarily one is more vulnerable than the other. But did you know that serious studies have proven that 93% of all of Windows vulnerabilities can be mitigated by the simple use of the Least User Access principle? It would be unthinkable for reasonable Unix users to use a root super-user id to visit hostile and unknown environments such as the Internet. Thus the principle of a regular ID, substituted to root id, via the 'su' or 'sudo' modifier, to perform admin functions on a selective and focused basis. The exact same can be performed in Windows via the use of 'run as'. Alas I wish everybody kept the same standards, instead of this nonsense / delimiter for Unix, versus for Windows. That is ridiculous, I'm not sure on whose part? On this triviality, I will say Windows is at fault since it came afterwards of the Unix convention. Also unknown to many neophytes, is the fact Windows is actually a superset of Unix, having built-in subsystems to support both a Unix and OS/2 layers, in addition to the native Windows framework. Yes one can add the SFU Services for Unix, optionally to Windows, or simply use cygwin to perform most if not all POSIX functions directly from within Windows. But I digress.

I would also suggest that on the Internet-at-large, like in a public discussion forums, people will be talking about vulnerabilities, that have nothing to do with closed info such as the Microsoft Intranet for instance. Due to the 89% market share penetration of Windows, it would stand to reason to expect there would be a lot more vulnerabilities discussed for that platform from external users to Microsoft, from a simple statistical perspective?

As for the auto-play or removable disk vector, Windows is still vulnerable, even if patched with the critical security update MS08-067, if an administrator falls for the social engineering trick, to browse a mysterious folder, which is in fact the Conficker worm executable disguised as a folder:

!http://blogs.technet.com/photos/mmpcblog/images/3190621/original.aspx!
Note under the Install or run program the folder icon? Publisher not specified? That is in fact the Conficker executable waiting for an admin to deliver its payload... But Windows won't auto-run the executable, merely provide a popup that shows you something new is seen by the system. The responsibility to click judiciously, still rests on the user.

The solution is trivial: Unless the user is administrator, this executable will fail. Also if any decent AV solution was in effect at the time, it would halt and destroy the virus on the spot! Thirdly, any diligent user, would have noticed the subterfuge through awareness, and not that sense of invulnerability, false sense of security...

Thus my warning about "Watch your step"...

And I re-iterate my belief that 99.99% of all computer problems root causes can be credited to whatever sits between the chair and keyboard.

MS08-067 only prevents the mechanism by which the worm propagates without any interaction from a user, silently across the entire network by using known vulnerabilities in the OS.

Now a large percentage of Windows users are using administrator due to ill-behaved sub-standard applications in which the software designers did not fully understand the fine granularity of security ACLs available to them, basically were too lazy to follow the API, and simply wrote their software with all rights, just like root under Unix, so they didn't have to deal with the intricacies of hierarchical security concepts. It isn't Windows fault. But these legacy crappy programs and applications force the majority of Windows users to remain in admin mode. Credit where credit is due. It is due to lame and lazy third party programmers, that forces end-users to be super-users. Or else, their purchased programs won't run. Thus the critical importance to only purchase or use free software that has the Certified for Windows Vista qualification label. Not too many programs do that. Not even Adobe, or Firefox bother, instead covering up their inane aptitudes, by deflecting the blame onto Microsoft under guise of a money grab... But I digress. As evidenced by the late vulnerabilities affecting all OS, Windows, Linux and OS X, were caused by vulnerabilities in Firefox and Adobe precisely! Nuf said for now on that topic.

But the solution is simple to the end-users, that want peace of mind. Simply use Windows Certified programs and applications, and nothing else. Easier said than done however, hence explaining the state of affairs, everybody pointing the finger at each other, and spewing FUD all over to cover their asses.

If anyone gets infected by the Conficker worm, it's not anybody's fault but theirs. Alas, not too many people are mature and honorable enough to admit that. Hey that's human nature.

Nice chatting with you my friend. I wish you the best, and am sure we will have many further interesting conversations, as members of the PCWorld Community.

We're all here to learn from each other, and teach each other. Thus mutually expanding our collective horizons.

Cheers!

~~~~~~~~~~
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#68 User is offline   Majo Icon

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Posted 31 March 2009 - 03:22 PM

This is the best way and step by step instructions I could find to remove Conficker



http://www.livecrunc...conficker-worm/
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#69 User is offline   cornbone Icon

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 05:40 AM

Dear WinTard,

Your vocabulary is as wanting as your outdated attitude about Macs. The word equivocate makes no sense the way you used it. Stick to words you understand or look up the big ones before you embarass yourself. And update your rhetoric about how much Macs suck. It's dated, and incorrect. I use both PCs and Macs at work and I vastly prefer the Macs. Here are some of the misconceptions you are under. Macs make up far more than 2% of the market. I believe it is 4 or 5% now, Macs gained a full point in the past year or two and about 25% of new laptops are Macs. Under the hood of a very slick, user friendly OS is the Unix operating system, well established, secure and powerful. Dollar for dollar, Macs are not more expensive than PCs, if you bother to be fair and compare equivalent computers. Granted, you can't get a $300 Mac, but I wouldn't buy a $300 PC. Take the side off a Mac and you'll see hardware that looks like a work of art. Open the best PC and it's still a jumble of twisted jumpers and DIP switches. Our I.T. director was a PC zealot for years until he got a Mac Mini for his kids. Within 6 months he was doing all his work on a Mac 17" lMac aptop When he started saying "the OS doesn't get in my way, I'm running multiple Windows and Linux virtual machines plus Mac OS, it's simple and user friendly, the security is impressive, etc etc etc, I thought I was dreaming. If a former Mac hating, PC zealot (whose initials are actually P.C. by the way) can become a Mac convert, then these old prejudices about Macs are just jingoism and platform bigotry. When was the last time you actually used a Mac? Have you ever. I have used Macs since 1987. I have had 4 of them. How many computers does the average PC user buy in 22 years? Open your mind.
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#70 User is online   WinTard Icon

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 06:19 AM

cornbone said:

Dear WinTard,

Your vocabulary is as wanting as your outdated attitude about Macs. The word equivocate makes no sense the way you used it. Stick to words you understand or look up the big ones before you embarass yourself. And update your rhetoric about how much Macs suck. It's dated, and incorrect. I use both PCs and Macs at work and I vastly prefer the Macs. Here are some of the misconceptions you are under. Macs make up far more than 2% of the market. I believe it is 4 or 5% now, Macs gained a full point in the past year or two and about 25% of new laptops are Macs. Under the hood of a very slick, user friendly OS is the Unix operating system, well established, secure and powerful. Dollar for dollar, Macs are not more expensive than PCs, if you bother to be fair and compare equivalent computers. Granted, you can't get a $300 Mac, but I wouldn't buy a $300 PC. Take the side off a Mac and you'll see hardware that looks like a work of art. Open the best PC and it's still a jumble of twisted jumpers and DIP switches. Our I.T. director was a PC zealot for years until he got a Mac Mini for his kids. Within 6 months he was doing all his work on a Mac 17" lMac aptop When he started saying "the OS doesn't get in my way, I'm running multiple Windows and Linux virtual machines plus Mac OS, it's simple and user friendly, the security is impressive, etc etc etc, I thought I was dreaming. If a former Mac hating, PC zealot (whose initials are actually P.C. by the way) can become a Mac convert, then these old prejudices about Macs are just jingoism and platform bigotry. When was the last time you actually used a Mac? Have you ever. I have used Macs since 1987. I have had 4 of them. How many computers does the average PC user buy in 22 years? Open your mind.


Dear cornbone,

First let me I congratulate you on your appropriate choice of nickname corn bone. It speaks volume about your level of intellect and where your mind is at. I would find it embarrassing myself but that is your own personal choice. Your pedantic April fool?s Day rant is out of topic concerning Windows PC protection against the Conficker worm. Please start your own rant thread about the delusionary so called advantages of your inept choices of computing platform elsewhere. You and other trolls are not welcome to hijack this thread. This is PCWorld, not MacWorld. Please be considerate towards other community member?s time, interests and focus while expressing your preferences. You do not see me posting on MacWorld? Perhaps it is you and other blind Mac fanatics and Apple cult followers who should approach the world as it is with an open mind... With such a narrow view of the world, it is imperative you expand your horizons. And once you provide the proper venue for such a debate, I will be glad to join the discussion. But not here in this Conficker prevention thread.

~~~~~~~~~~
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Churchill: ?If I were your husband I would take it.?
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#71 User is offline   coastie65 Icon

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 06:34 AM

Cornbone, I agree that this is OFF TOPIC and little more than a rant and has no place in this thread. I would suggest that any future posts be directly related to the topic being discussed.



WinTard, I would remind you to be very careful in how you word your posts so as not to be inflammatory, and a personal attack. This could be very easily taken as a personal attack, and provoke a like response, initiating a flame war which is not permissable.

coastie
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#72 User is online   WinTard Icon

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 06:39 AM

I apologize to all the community for my words exceeding my thoughts. I felt the initiating post was inflammatory, but two wrongs do not make one right.

My apologies, to cornbone, and the entire community for my lapse of coolness. Sincerely.

~~~~~~~~~~
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So long as a man is angry he cannot be in the right.
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#73 User is offline   coastie65 Icon

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 07:03 AM

Hi Win, You are right, two wrongs don't make a right. I was going to post in regards to cornbone's post, but you jumped in before I could. I always advise one , before posting in an emontional state, to step back and take a deep breath, as not doing so can only end up exacerbating the situtation. coastie
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Posted 01 April 2009 - 07:39 AM

He doesn't hate Macs and I stand behind much of what he says. If you want to compare Macs to low or mid-ranged Windows based PC than sure a Mac is going to be better. So why not compare them to high caliper based system who are known to have excellent quality. And the fact still remain...Macs cost 20 to 40% more then a comparable Windows PC. You want to compare laptops? Asus has a Quadcore one that offers way more spec-wise then any Macbook Pro Price around $1999 a Macbook Pro that comes close starts at $2499 with only dualcore. The Dell XPS is a highend PC and the Laptop and workstation even without the Dell Discount will give you a $200 to $400 swing both ways. Sometimes Macs are a bit cheaper, but you also get less too. Alienware makes 1st game gaming laptops that have spec that laugh at Macbooks and Mac Pros...I can get a desktop from them with Extreme Edition for less than a Mac. The the latest Extremes are teh same as the latest Xeons. But Pentium is better than Xeon. Xeon is a server cpu...it wasn't designed for flatout racing perfromance, it was designed for system like servers that have repetitive tasks and the 3 levels of cache serve as a emeory for the cpu to store those tasks....Any Extreme Edition based system will potentially outperform a Xeon based one. Sony's Vaio line is right up there with a Mac. In many cases SOny cost more. However Sony is a company like Apple that doesn't plan to make all its money on computer sales...And lastly the ThinkPad. Even when IBM owned it out of all the top ten laptops reviews since it was create, a ThinkPad always made the list and in most cases in the top 5. In fact IBM set a standard for what an excellent laptop should be. The swing even with new owners is $200 to $400 swing in either direction

Anaylst state as a fact Macs cost 20/40% more then a typical Windows based..that's why Apple can afford to sell OSX for 129.99 the rest of the cost is gain from the cost of teh computer. Since MSFT doesn't make any money from the sell of teh computer they charge ore for teh software. However teh cost of Windows Vista Premium is $150 on ALL brandnew system and you can get Ultimate for 199 if you know how to be a smart shopper. Only a dumbass would ever buy on retail level anyway. When it comes to repairs for out of warranty equipment I can take my PC anywhere. Not evenryone can repair a Mac (that has changed now that they are x86).

Windows PC are also more backwards compatible. Any todays Windows based PC with a few simple changes can run ANY previous version of DOS, Windows, Linux, Unix, Solaris and more....try that with a Mac. In the pass 22 years I purchased at this point 2 computers I built myselft. The combine cost of both was $2500. By now I would have spent at least 3 times as much if I had bought a Mac.

Macs are great high quality computers and oin case you forgot they run Windows now too.
The fact is to get good computing you don't have to spend $1000's on a new computer. Macs do not offer nothing more then pc users have been doing for decades. Macs have only just begun to be comparable.

And my first computers I ever bought on retail level was teh full Apple II series. That is teh time Apple had it right, prices were pretty fair and teh user was actually important. Once Steve battles against the Apple IL's with his Mac creation that was teh end of that. It hasn't changed. WinTard isn['t amc hater, what he does hate if teh dillusional thinking that Mac users have...such as we don't have to deal with virus issues and so forth...Dealing and being aware of them are 2 different things. Macs do have them and so does Windows...I have ran Windows since 3.1 and I only have just since 2006 ran anti-virus on a native level...and i have never had an issue...even when I had my web host business I ran NO anti-virus at all, even with Exchange. If you know how to compute you won't need it. However because I know how to drive it doesn't mean I should have insurance. Bec you never know. To not make urself safe for whatever reason in this age is simply stupid.

You can check the internet for any fact related to a Windows based PC. And here is another fact. x86 hardware is cheap...I can build a computer with spec's that match and exceed Macs 2 to 1 and pay less than 1/2 the cost. The quality will be same or better. Inside my case it is clean and there aren'r cords all over the place. Knowledge is power amd if you just take tie an read and learn you may actually find out there is more to life then a box.
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#75 User is offline   coastie65 Icon

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 07:46 AM

TechieXP, As I earlier explained, this topic is about Protecting against confiker. It IS NOT about the merits of Mac vs PC or vice versa, so again, I would remind you to keep your comments confined to those dealing with the topic. coastie65
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#76 User is offline   coastie65 Icon

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 07:53 AM

TechieXP, As I have explained earlier, this topic is dealing with Protection against Confiker and it IS NOT about the merits of the Mac vs PC or vice versa. Again, I would remind you to keep your comments confined to the topic.

To Those who may wish to respond to the above post, DON'T. Keep all comments in line with the topic.

coastie65
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#77 User is offline   TechieXP Icon

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 07:58 AM

I don't think his answer in retort was all that bad. Some things in life simply has to be said. You can't sugarcoat life. If they want to come here and cause trouble we can give them some. And I can fight back with facts.

Facts like:

Macs cost 20 - 40% more then pc spec'd the same - (this can swibg both ways...but high favors Windows based PC's) And even thos Macs aren't advertised as PC's they are nothing but. Same hardware same sofware (now that Macs run Windows)
In 33 years Apple manged to have a 10% marketshare with a sales quota of about 5 million units per year. The avrage Windows PC company sells 3 times as many in a givene year at teh least - (Dell sold close too 14 million units in a single quarter.)
Mac OSX is not backwards compatable with any previous version of Mac OS based system. (All pc's are still backwards compatible with ANY version of Windows.)
Macs aren't immune to sickness...

If he didn't want a fight, he should have come here trying to pick one. He lucky I didn't answer. They are the ones that need to grow up. We dont go to Mac threads and spread crap. I don't see the logic of people claim they are so happy using other products find teh time to come here and talk. If I had a Mac and was happy with it, I wouldn't even visit a Windows based thread unless i plan to use it.

The leader in the PC industry may not be the best one, but I don't see anyone better. They all are great companies and have contributed great things that moved us forward and that includes Apple. But you all really need to let go. The market has spoken to which is the best option. Try getting into teh same shoes before you poke out your chest.
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#78 User is offline   TechieXP Icon

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 08:09 AM

I'll try to cooperate :-))

How about we fix the PCWorld web page so that it only works with IE, that way the majority of ppl we don't want here won't be able to visit here. That way when they use IE to get here and they spread crap, we can say if it is so bad you went an extra step to use it to get here in the first place. Must not be that bad.

But anyway I'm done with this topic. Hey WinTard very awesome advice on protecting agaist the above. I have running a test today. I have 2 pc's on 2 different networks at home one running anti-virus and one not. I opened all ports and I just want to see if it will get an infection today...and I asked my girlfriend to use the unprotected one and visit any and every site she possibly can to just see what happens. i am willing to bet nothing. I did a fresh install of Windows Vista...no Service Packs or patches using the original OEM disk I bought in 2006.
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#79 User is offline   coastie65 Icon

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Posted 01 April 2009 - 08:10 AM

First, cornbone's post was off topic and yes most likely inflammatory. I was going to post a warning before WinTard jumped in with a post, that just would in all likelyhood have escalated the situation. As a mod, I am am not going to allow this to continue, and will bring it back on topic. You were adding to something that was off topic and where a warning had been posted accordingly, thus the follow up warning. coastie
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Posted 01 April 2009 - 08:18 AM

TechieXP said:

I'll try to cooperate :-))


Hey WinTard very awesome advice on protecting agaist the above. I have running a test today. I have 2 pc's on 2 different networks at home one running anti-virus and one not. I opened all ports and I just want to see if it will get an infection today...and I asked my girlfriend to use the unprotected one and visit any and every site she possibly can to just see what happens. i am willing to bet nothing. I did a fresh install of Windows Vista...no Service Packs or patches using the original OEM disk I bought in 2006.





:^0 This ought to be interesting. At the very least you ought to find a few Vundo's and maybe a ZLOB or two along the way, plus who knows what else.
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