[Erick10]

Bro, trust me, not everyone wants a wack phone like the Iphone. If we really wanted one, we would go buy one since thyre so cheap with ATT. Who would want to go to a company who has one of the worst 3G coverage in the nation. Yeah I have Sprint and there is alot of hate against them from other people but Sprint has steped it up lately. Who had first the Touch Pro and Touch Diamond in the U.S.? Sprint. Its really easy to drop @200 on an Iphone but I would never get a phone like this. Im a Windows Mobile Fan Boy for life I guess. I dont care how ugly the UI is, I dont care of the looks, thats for Bitxhes. I want a phone that suits my needs.

[mdg1019]

supergohan said:

As is the norm PC World again criticizes anything that has a microsoft or nokia on it and goes gaga over a fruit!

Agreed. If they didn't already have a sister publication called MacWorld, it would be more appropriate to call it MacWorld. Maybe they should rename it to Macworld, etc. I don't even know why they bother with calling it PCWorld. The name's a joke. They are so heavily biased toward Apple it isn't even funny anymore.

It's hard to take anything they publish seriously due to their obvious bias towards all things Apple. If they can be so easily influenced by one computer manufacturer, how are we as readers to know whether they skew the truth when publishing reviews about other products.

[mdg1019]

JakeB said:

Let me guess, Techie Boy -- don't have an iPhone but deep in your heart of hearts, you REALLY, REALLY want one.

So you gotta rain on everyone's parade. And by everyone I mean the millions who use, enjoy, and LOVE their iPhones, iPods, and Macs.

Windows Mobile!

It's okay, dude. We feel your pain.

Dude, you seriously need a girlfriend.

[dingbow2408]

"The BlackBerry OS is an old dog.", best statement of the article. Why I stuck around and defended the Blackberry line for so many years? Basically, because I didn't know any better. Like most people they feel they need to defend their purchase, what their company stuck them with, they couldn't afford something else... whatever. I'm just pitching that these lame Crackberry Geezers should realize that there are other solutions out there, better ones! Get the Palm Pre, get the iPhone, just try something else outside of that Blackberry OS. For God sake, EVOLVE. Smartphones can be beautiful, easy to use, and fun!

[chuckchuck]

I just want to know one thing - can the iPhone make phone calls? I mean, seriously . . . how's the connectivity? the clarity? does it drop frequently? the thing is an iTouch with a phone - does the phone work?!

[mdg1019]

chuckchuck said:

I just want to know one thing - can the iPhone make phone calls? I mean, seriously . . . how's the connectivity? the clarity? does it drop frequently? the thing is an iTouch with a phone - does the phone work?!

It seems no better and no worse than any other phone that I've owned.

[dingbow2408]

"A new Medialets speed test has found that the iPhone 3GS is "even faster than Apple claims" it is. In fact, after testing the iPhone 3GS against the Palm Pre, T-Mobile G1, and an iPhone 3G using the SunSpider test suite, a Javascript benchmark, Medialets found that the iPhone 3GS running OS 3.0 is almost three times as fast as the iPhone 3G and Palm Pre, and 5.5 times faster than the T-Mobile G1. That?s even faster than Apple's claims that the 3GS is twice as fast as the 3G."

If anyone disagrees that speed is important on a smartphone, then they should go back into their basement and watch black and white TV. Can we just all agree that the iPhone 3GS is fastest out there?

[mdg1019]

dingbow2408 wrote:"A new Medialets speed test has found that the iPhone 3GS is "even faster than Apple claims" it is. In fact, after testing the iPhone 3GS against the Palm Pre, T-Mobile G1, and an iPhone 3G using the SunSpider test suite, a Javascript benchmark, Medialets found that the iPhone 3GS running OS 3.0 is almost three times as fast as the iPhone 3G and Palm Pre, and 5.5 times faster than the T-Mobile G1. That’s even faster than Apple's claims that the 3GS is twice as fast as the 3G."
If anyone disagrees that speed is important on a smartphone, then they should go back into their basement and watch black and white TV. Can we just all agree that the iPhone 3GS is fastest out there?
Speed is certainly important, BUT...

"Disclaimer: Before considering the results of the tests, it is
important to note that each OS likely has certain advantages and
features that probably make it inherently well suited for some tasks
more than others. The main purpose of these comparisons is merely to
compare Javascript performance within each environment. It should not
be misconstrued as indicative of which device or OS is inherently
“better” than any other."

The above disclaimer is a direct quote from the results of the Medialets' speed test. It makes an important point. A narrowly defined benchmark never tells the whole story. The 3G S may have better raw speed at processing Javascript, but that doesn't necessarily make it faster at other tasks. For example, does the 3G S really display web pages faster in the real world. Javascript is important to displaying web content, but it's not the whole picture by any means.

About the only thing this study does show is that the 3G S is definitely a lot faster than previous versions of the iPhone. But anybody with half a brain already knows that.

It will also be interesting to see if the speed gap between the mobile operating systems narrows as WebOS and Android have more time to mature. Apple definitely has a head start, but I doubt if they'll maintain that kind of speed difference in the future. The first out of the gate doesn't necessarily win the race. Apple doesn't exactly have a stellar track record when they have a huge head start in an operating system war. Just look back at how Microsoft buried Apple in the desktop market and will be shoveling even more dirt on to the Apple coffin when Win 7 is released.

[epgomez]

Again and again I hear people here say it's a great product. When it comes to design and software to a certain extent I would agree but it's a bad phone with bad battery life and a lot of limitations compared to other smartphones. Apple is ok with software to a certain extent but the others as well but they're not still there yet when it comes to cellphone hardware technology and the OS is still not there yet to be truly good for small devices. They have to turn off multitasking to save battery life and a lot of things that goes against their interest at the expense of becoming a totally good product but people rely on the image without realizing how far this gadget can go at this day and age and people are still happy with mediocre tech like this.

[dingbow2408]

Point taken Mr. mdg1019. I do respect your insight. I also found this on the internet:

iPhone 3GS Performance Comparison: iPhone 3GS beats Palm Pre, G1 and iPhone 3G
http://www.iphonehac...-iphone-3g.html

As long as its not anything with a "Blackberry OS" inside that I have to deal with, I'm all game. I need the speed now, not sometime down the road when others may catch up. I think the 3GS is the way to go right now (money burning a hole). Perhaps you're right, if other healthy communities pop up out there for consumers to select from, it's all good for us. I think the important thing is the willingness to explore, and not be retarded fanboys for any product line.

[dingbow2408]

Curiously, so what is your suggestion as the ultimate over all smartphone, with the best of everything as possible... money no object. Please don't mention a Blackberry anything because their UI is horrid and old school, been there done that. I don't need their enterprise security BS that they are clinging to for dear life. Come on, Man, stick your neck out there. If you're willing to flame Apple, then you can certainly pitch something else. I'm open to a new smartphone... like right now.

[mdg1019]

dingbow2408 said:

Point taken Mr. mdg1019. I do respect your insight. I also found this on the internet:

I think the important thing is the willingness to explore, and not be retarded fanboys for any product line.

I would wholeheartedly agree with that. :)

I really only have two issues with the iPhone. AT&T and the app store monopoly. I really like my 3G. However, I despise AT&T at this point and will probably give up my iPhone this fall just to get away from them. Hopefully, Apple will end their exclusive association with AT&T when their current contract expires next year. If that happens, I may indeed own another iPhone in the future, but not as long as it will lock me into ever doing business with AT&T again. Be really, really careful when dealing with AT&T. Their sales people will outright lie to you. Read and understand every single line of everything you sign. Don't trust an AT&T employee to be honest when dealing with you. Just some friendly advice to anybody who's thinking about getting an iPhone. ;)

If you can put up with AT&T, then based on my experience with the 3G, I don't think you could go wrong with a 3G S.

[qingwa]

If you look at it from a purely business standpoint, Palm has a difficult road ahead. They are competing with Google (Android), Microsoft (Windows Mobile), Apple (iPhone OS), RIM (Blackberry) and Nokia for developers for their platform.

A smartphone is more than an internet, clock and a calender. Its kind of like a laptop if I can use that analogy. No one will buy a laptop with no programs, similarly people will not seek to adopt a smartphone with no apps. A smartphone with no apps has little added utility beyond a feature phone.

With the Pre having only 30 apps, and the smallest established base of users (estimated around 150,000) competing against tens of millions established users on the iPhone and Blackberry and millions of users on Android already, developers will not be running over themselves to spend venture capital money on the smallest platform base supported by the least financially stable company (Palm).

Palm as you may know had a stock price of less than $2 before the Pre announcement and had to get a $450 million dollar capital injection from Bono (of U2) to save the company.

Consumers should look at the big picture, not running after the newest gadget. Look at what happened to the format HDDVD, Blu-ray won. The market can support 3-5 smartphone platforms, I don't think there are enough developers that it can support 6 (Android, iPhone, Windows, RIM, Symbian, WebOS).

In several years time, 1-2 of the smartphone platforms will go under due to lack of developer support. If you look at computers, the general public can only support two platforms, Windows and Mac OS. If you look at gaming systems, there are only 3 platforms. There are simply not enough developers, especially as these apps get more intensive and more difficult to program.

[TechieXP]

What is so bad about Blackberry? I use to say I dodn't like Blackberries bec I didn't like the look of the phone. I also said I'd never buy one. The best phone I ever owned and should have kept was the Pakm Treo 700w, which is the model that Sprint carries that has Windows Mobile. After switching to Verizon I needed a nice PDA. With Verizon offering 2 for 1 I figure I try the Storm since I wanted a touchscreen phone and I didn't want ATT even though I wanted the iPhone.

One of teh girls I worked with had also just recently left Sprint and switched to Verizon and had teh Storm. After she let me play with it for about 15 mins, I was hooked. The UI may not be fancy as iPhone...but it is very easy to use...its a simply clean interface and I like teh fact that it doesn't require jailbreaking to enjoy it. Even for something as simple as changing the theme requires jailbreaking the iPhone. That is purely to much control. I want the phone to belong to me. Its bad enough that even when I buy Windows I never own it. Not going to deal with that with another company. Especially Apple.

There is nothong wrong with Blackberries. It's choice. Just bec you are so in love with your iPhone, doesn't mean everyone will or has to be. Its just music player with the phone feature. Yes the Iphone is pretty...just like all of Apple's devices. But that is simply where it stops. The Touch/iPhone UI is very nice...but it isn't ll that great when you subtract teh things you can't do...yet ATT still charges you for it.

For a company that trimed down their OS to fit on the phone (other have already been there done that) I think iPhone UI is crappy as far as handling tasks. The Pre is certainly much better at it. And the phone just came out and no one is giving it 1/2 teh chance. Apple has issues with iPhone/Touch when they first came out. So did RIMM and Palm os too. But at last the llatter 2 jump on fixing issues right away. But not Apple. They are slow at fixing everything. And OSX the least most secure OS in the world and you wonder why using iPhone is unsafe for business. I rather be safe than to be pretty.

I just dpn't get why everyone is so gaga over iPhone and there are better phones. The fact that out of teh top 5 phones that are Smartphones...3 are from RIMM and the only reason Storm didn't win over iPhone was bec of software problems. But a new Storm is coming and it has wifi as well and RIMM has plenty of time too tweak it before release to pit itself 100% against iPhone. And there are still others who have yet to enter the game. Like Microsoft who can certainly use their jack to beat Apple like they did in the beginning with Windows and they already had teh best touchscreen UI with Surface. If they could scale it down and put it into a phone..iPhone would be history. Its already slowig in sales as Apple can't even captilize on their own design. 3 versions that are basically all the same phone. At least other putfits change it up a bit. But poor Apple...the company that claims that MSFT has no originality has fallen prey to its own. They iPhone a copy of teh LG Prada physical design and a UI that another company is suing Apple saying they stole it...amazing isn't it?

Ip[hone is simply a combination of allthe best ideas from other [hones. None of the features of iPhone are new and they certainly are not the best. I rather shove the Web OS into the physical hardware of iPhone and then u'd have an amazing phone.

[TechieXP]

Oh please...30 appz that are at least good an not repeats of them selves. Why not check out the iPhone Appz...the majority of them are 5 to 10 of the same appz. How many flashlights appz do u need. How hard is it to buy a Maglite? How any fart appz do you need...oh that really helpful. Why do you need an app to find your car? If you can't remember where you parked then maybe you shouldn't be driving. Unless you're a contractor why to a need a level?

Most of teh appz are just garbage. If you subtract all the repeated appz and only pick the ones that matter...there are about 100 really good ones. Which means Pre with 30 and certainly catch up. Also Apple hyped teh phone 6 months before its release...giving time for appz to be made. Palm did not do that. However how many good apps did iPhone have on it release...about 30 if that. Most of iPhones app ca easily be ported over to other phones. Java based ones are the easiets to move. However Palm said they want to have quality appz...most of iPhone appz are time wasters to even view.

Its amazing how ur bashing a newly released product. Not everyone has to do it like Apple to be successful. RIMM is very successful and they don't glamorize there phones. They do solid quality ads for their devices. Apple has to sensationalize there devices bec in reality most of them suck. In 4 decades of existance Apple has release 2 devices that made a mark..Apple II and iPod...The Touch and Iphone are essentially fancier iPods...correct?

First was iPod..then the Touch which is a gfancier more expesve iPod and then they added the phone to it. Sounds very familiar doesn't ot?

I do agree Plam has to go against soe heavy hitters...but just remember they pioneered the devices that bec the smartphones of today. The best thing a company can do is not be like Apple. Apple simply got lucky by hyping the iPod. With Iphd teh other 2 devices don't even exist. Palm however has a history a several good devices...so they have teh experience...and so does MSFT. MSFT is even better bec they don't make a phone they simply make the software..and it works. Windows Mobile is bland but it works...just like Backberry OS..its bland but it works. Iphone OS is fancy and doesn't work all that well in many areas. Sure many developers can learn some good points...but as you see Pre went further...especially doing what Apple can't do in 3 updates..make a phone that has good multi-tasking..like a true OS. That coming from a company (Apple) that makes an OS....

No hardware has every just been great right away...it takes time especially for one that uses appz...not everyone has to have an app store like Apple to be sucessful...this is the first time Apple has ever had a hardware that wasn't just for a niche market. It took them 40 years to get here...wjhiles others have had greater success at it.

All these other newbies are just again liucky. I checked out Android...its boring. Its not even better than what is on Blackberry. Its simply clean and fuctional...and teh phones look lousy to me. but that is my opinion. The single best phone on the market is the one you chose to buy...

[smax013]

TechieXP said:

Oh please...30 appz that are at least good an not repeats of them selves. Why not check out the iPhone Appz...the majority of them are 5 to 10 of the same appz. How many flashlights appz do u need. How hard is it to buy a Maglite? How any fart appz do you need...oh that really helpful. Why do you need an app to find your car? If you can't remember where you parked then maybe you shouldn't be driving. Unless you're a contractor why to a need a level?

Most of teh appz are just garbage. If you subtract all the repeated appz and only pick the ones that matter...there are about 100 really good ones. Which means Pre with 30 and certainly catch up. Also Apple hyped teh phone 6 months before its release...giving time for appz to be made. Palm did not do that. However how many good apps did iPhone have on it release...about 30 if that. Most of iPhones app ca easily be ported over to other phones. Java based ones are the easiets to move. However Palm said they want to have quality appz...most of iPhone appz are time wasters to even view.

So, by your logic, the thousands of applications that run on Windows that do not run on the Mac OS are just garbage since they must all be duplicates and most do not matter. While I might use a Mac and find it to be rather useful, I would NEVER claim such a thing.

There are LOTS of good apps for Windows that do not exist on a Mac. Sure, there will be some that are duplicates. And there will be lots that I have absolutely no use for, but that does not mean that NO ONE has a use for them.

The point is that a lot of those apps for the iPhone that YOU believe do not "matter", actually do matter to lots of other people.

In the end, you are offering up rationalizations to make the Pre seem better off than it is in terms of available applications. Sorry, but the iPhone is WAY ahead of it. Now, this does not mean it cannot change. The Pre is literally less than a month old....so it is kind of a "duh moment" that is does not have many applications yet. After all, the iPhone did not have ANY third party applications until about year after it was first introduced because Steve Jobs and Apple did not believe in third party apps until enough iPhone users whined about it (and this was a BIG reason why I never even remotely considered an iPhone when it first came out). I fully expect the Pre to have more apps in the future. Will it compete with the iPhone in number and diversity of apps? I do not really know, but I would say there is a darn good chance.

And unless Palm implements acceptance rules/criteria that makes Apple's look rather lenient, they will get their share of "time wasters" as well. Any computer program platform (Palm OS, WebOS, iPhone OS, Windows, Mac OS, Linux, etc) will have programs that are "time wasters".

In the end, the reality is that the iPhone has WAY more applications, both useful and useless, than the Pre does and this gives the iPhone a huge advantage right now...and not amount of rationalizing it away will actually change that fact. Only time can change that fact as more and more apps come out for the Pre.

FWIW, I rather like the Pre. I stopped at the Sprint Store today and played around with it some. When I am ready to upgrade my phone, I will seriously consider it as there are still things that I do not like about the iPhone (not the least of which is that I would have to switch to AT&T), especially when compared to my Palm Treo 755p. I have time, however, as my Treo still works just fine for my needs. So, maybe the Pre will start to have some of the apps that I would like by the time I am ready for a new phone.

[TechieXP]

Exactly.

I have no problem saying at all that even though Windows support more applications and hardware, doesn't mean a lot of them aren't gargabe...bec they are. Here is a fact..when it comes to platforms that are EASY to develop for there will be a potential for lots of garbage. OSX is certainly a quality platform. However software for OSX has to be of great quality bec if it isn't Apple isn't going to allow it. MSFT does not play the middleman between Windows and what u buy. If you can't decide what is a quality application then maybe you should avoid the platform.

I believe in having options...but that does not mean all options are good. There are several anti-virus appz but not all are good. there are several appz for burining cd's but not all are good. there are several appz for teaching u to learn a new language but not all are good. There are sveral cars on the street...but just bec some people buy them doesn't mean they are good. It just means they are an affordable option.

The Windows platform just like iPhone both have lots of applications. With everal vendors trying to capitalize on another offering by offering something the other guy missed. However I can list over 5000 application avail on iphone that are complete garbage...and I can also do that for Windows. In fact EVERY platform has some garbage.

You may not be willing to say it...but I can..bec its teh truth. A fact is what it is whether we like it or not. Quality is Windows biggest problem. But not on MSFT end...but on the end of those who make hardware and software to use with it.

Back to topic.

The only thing iPhone has over any other phone is it has been put longer. Apple is proof that even a brand new device can be successful over another NO MATTER HOW LONG ITS BEEN AROUND. The problem for Apple fans, is they beleiev that once a product has been so wodely accepted it can't be beaten. Iphine is sill in second place behind RIMM. And teh deveice that is ahead is not even a touchscreen phone. Apple only has the best touchscreen device. But that doesn't mean it can't be beaten. I don't need to justify Pre. I ahven't even touched it. I have a Storm...and we have 5 users in our office with an Iphone. I have had a chance to play with plenty. I am simply not impressed...there are simply better options. Storm is a better option and would have beat iPhone if RIMM didn't have so many issues with the software. No matter how pretty a device is, if you don't have teh software to back i up...it will find only a niche market of users...the MAC is a perfect example.

There are lots of quality products that don't dominate a market and they don't have too. Only Apple fans think that bec this is he first time Apple has ever dominated a market and you all think that for a device to be successful it has to beat them...and fact IT DOESN"T. Even Steve jobs said MacWorld that for Apple to be sucessful they don't have to beat MSFT...that fact is when it comes to teh OS market they never will. Apple jumped into a market SFT doesn't dominate, made a very good device and found success. Even if Palm only sels 1/2 million phones that would be a success...

Apple fans simply need to think outside the Apple graden.
As far as comparing the OS. Apple did a fantastic job, but it is not perfect. For iphone to have been perfect it need to 1st...not be with ATT 2, have good multitasking...3rd...not just a phone added to a music player. but those are mu opinios.

Pre has all 3 of those. Sprint coverage is shotty, but it is better than ATT. For one only 3 carriers use CDMA/EVDO...Verizon, Sprint and Cricket. Sprint has the best data I have ever used as far as speed. When I was using them there wasn't a place I got crappy service accept in the city. Once i was away from tall buildings it worked very well. They simply have crappy customer service, but it is better than ATT on that level. I will gladly pay more for better service and most will. With iPhone and ATT you;'re getting neither.

Apple has set a bar, but sucess doesn't mean everyone needs to be above it. You only need to be abpve where it matters. I don't care about a bunch of appz...i only buy what I need anyways...which on a phone is NONE. The only thing on my phone I like to change is the themes...and I can do that for free and without hailbreaking the phone...can iPhone...NO. I have a phone that I use for gaming...my old Sprint Instinct. So I don't need to buy the games again. I don't like using phones for gaming...tyhey are to small and to slow. If I at to game I have a PC for that. When I travel I have a laptop for that. Those cheesy phone games are just something to pass tie. I have tetris on y Storm and the 2 games it came with. The only 2 appz i downed was Quick Pull which allows me to totally reset the phone without pulling the battery and a bettre memory cleaner. The phone has everything else I needed. Even if i had an iPhone i wouldn't buy any appz.

I like being able to transfer songs I want with being locked to an application. I like having removablke storage. I gacn have 2, 4, 8,16 and 32Gb of storage and a fraction of the cost to b locked to iphone. I ahve 3 emory cards with 16GB of stotage each with the music I like. can you do that with iPhone? No. That coming from a company that says they promote choice. I beg to differ.

[smax013]

TechieXP said:

Exactly.

I have no problem saying at all that even though Windows support more applications and hardware, doesn't mean a lot of them aren't gargabe...bec they are. Here is a fact..when it comes to platforms that are EASY to develop for there will be a potential for lots of garbage. OSX is certainly a quality platform. However software for OSX has to be of great quality bec if it isn't Apple isn't going to allow it. MSFT does not play the middleman between Windows and what u buy. If you can't decide what is a quality application then maybe you should avoid the platform.

Wrong...Apple does not restrict Mac OS X programs at all. Just because you keep repeating that false claim many times does not make it true. The only place where they have their boneheaded restrictions/approval process on applications is for the iPhone (and iPod Touch). The Mac OS development is just as wide open as Windows or Linux. The main reason why many software companies do not develop for the Mac is that it does not make financial sense for them. If you have a program that will only sell thousands of copies on Windows, then why would a developer spend time and money to port it to the Mac when the Mac OS has less then ten times the number of users.

>The only thing iPhone has over any other phone is it has been put longer. Apple is proof that even a brand new device can be successful over another NO MATTER HOW LONG ITS BEEN AROUND. The problem for Apple fans, is they beleiev that once a product has been so wodely accepted it can't be beaten. Iphine is sill in second place behind RIMM. And teh deveice that is ahead is not even a touchscreen phone. Apple only has the best touchscreen device. But that doesn't mean it can't be beaten. I don't need to justify Pre. I ahven't even touched it. I have a Storm...and we have 5 users in our office with an Iphone. I have had a chance to play with plenty. I am simply not impressed...there are simply better options. Storm is a better option and would have beat iPhone if RIMM didn't have so many issues with the software. No matter how pretty a device is, if you don't have teh software to back i up...it will find only a niche market of users...the MAC is a perfect example.

I have never said the iPhone cannot be beaten. What I get tired of is hearing how every new device is an "iPhone" killer...and none have done it yet. The Pre (or rather the WebOS) has a real chance to make a dent, but anyone with any common sense will realize that it is going to be an uphill battle. ANY new devices will have a major uphill battle as most people are "locked into" what they are used to, whether it be a Blackberry or iPhone. I suspect that you will find just as many passionate Blackberry users that will "poo-poo" the Pre as there are iPhone users, but since Apple is not involved with Blackberry, the anti-Apple folks ignore those (or claim they are secretly Apple fans even though they use Blackberries).

So you are not impressed with the iPhone. Good for you. I was not impressed in my experiences with Blackberries (both before and after the iPhone came out). I likely my Treo MUCH better than any Blackberry I used. But, we are both one person. There are millions of people who ARE impressed with the iPhone, so the fact that you are not impressed means squat to them. There are millions of people who are impressed with a Blackberry and who could careless that I am not impressed with a Blackberry.

As to your constant mantra of Apple devices are "pretty" and are not much beyond that...you feel free to keep thinking that. No matter how many times you repeat it, it will not make it true. The iPhone is more than it looks as are Macs for that matter. If you want to keep thinking there are all looks and no "play", then go ahead.

[TechieXP]

You say what I said isn't true? Tell you what. Here is where you can get the proof. Read the DOJ report of findings of fact against MSFT in the DOJ vs MSFT. It will tell you all you need to know. Its free for all public viewing...just google it.

Apple's platform isn't as open as you say it is. The potential for some developers to make millions on developing on OSX is there...there is simply one thing blocking it and it isn't money. That use to be the problem. Now that Macs are Intel PC's that is no longer an issue. Apple's previous platforms surely may not have been worth the expense...what about now? The problem is for applications Apple wants a piece of the pie too...and it isn't just for the iPhone.

Adobe continues to develope for Apple bec of thir long time relationship and bec Adobe makes a software that is contunually used on the Mac. If they didn't they too wouldn't be aking software for the Mac. MSFT still makes applications for the Mac...if MSFT wasn't having success with Office on the Mac surely MSFT would also feel the 10 mil users of MSFT Office on the Mac isn't worth teh time too...right?

Money isn't everything. However getting your software on more than one platform will make u oney. Look at MSFT as an example. They have WIndows on PC, phones, cash registers, scanners, cars and the list goes on. MSFT Windows itself is closed...but is built on a platform that is open..Apple's previous platforms were basically closed...x86 is open no matter who is using it..yet Apple has not had a jump in increasin deveopers...why...its bec of Apple. Whether you believe it to be true isn't my problem...thats urs. You se eit you way...I see it teh way it is.

As far as the phones. I am simply tired of iPhone. I think it is a great phone...however it is not teh best phone. It is popular bec if marketing. Since I am a technician and have worked with Palm, MSFT and Apple with their phones as far as setting them up I agree with you the Treo 650 with Palms OS and teh 700w with Windows Mobiles are to be the best...even over Blackberry. Next...I rather work with BB on an Enterprises level vs iPhone.

As far as iPhjone Killer...no company that has ever released a phone said it was such. That was all started by the media and Apple fanbois who feel wvery touchscreen phone has to be such. Apple who Iphone is a aftermarket copy of teh LG Prada...certainly set a bar of what a very nice phone could be...and Apple fansbois feel a phone isn't sucessful unless it beats Apples phone...and they don't have to. Out of the 5 phone sold...the BB Curve is 1st, iPhone is 2nd, Storm 3rd and teh BB Bold os 4th. Which means combined RIMM is still selling more phones than Apple...I don't care if some fanboi says RIMM is giving them away. Whatever it takes Apple is still second.

Every sngle features teh iphone has appeared on other phones 1st...PERIOD. Apple simply ade a way to make those features blend cleanly...however just like any other phone Apple also has had problems. And again to really enjoy the phone to have to jailbreak it.

The Pre simply has a better software. if you like a metal phone with a plastic back than get an iPhone. So far that pl;ast back has [roven to be a bad design for a product that gets hot. BB has a metal backing...as I said pretty isn't everything. Preyty usually means sacrificing quality....thus the term dunmb blonde...right? It is what it is.

As Eveildave saiys...just bec a device is popular doesn't mean its the best...being least popular certainly doesn't mean its the worse. Just bec Pre may not outsell Apple doesn't mean it is a failed device. It somply means it has a successful nuche market...the same one Apple has been living in for 40 years. They got out with one device the iPod. THis is onlt teh second time in history APple has had a very successful device on this level. The Apple II was the fi1st. The Touch and iPhone are both expensive iPods that add a new function.

The iPhone as fancy as it is, just gt shown up by the Pre. Palm a company that has had cheesy software on its phones just hit the top with has been rewared as being the best OS on a phone EVER. Better than OSX, better than Windows Mobile and better tha Android. Its multi-yasking ability is teh best ever on any portable device that is a phone.

But ppl are so high on Apple's BS they can't she progress bec they think Apple is some leader. They are not. They simply made a very good device that they simply hyped the shit out of. Apple has way more money that Palm, so thus they can pay to have ore units built...but QUALITY is based on QUANITY now is it? There are many quality products in the world...but they are not the world leaderin quanity...are they?

I am entitle to feel the BB Strom is a better phone than iPhone. I wanted an iPhone but I don't want a nice phone on a less quality carrier. ATT sucks. I don't want to pay for features I can use. Apple also took the 3 updates to have features ALL Smartphones had from the beginning...that to me is milking. Why did Apple wait until update 3 to release features cheap @$$ phones have...its called milking. And you all say MSFT is bad? NO they are not.

Apple niche was created by Apple...
I am not teh only one not so impressed by the iPhone. That fact any people are still buying millions of other phones prove this.

Motorola stills hold the title for the most widely single sold standard cellphone. Apple leads the sell as what is called a Smartphone. However iPhone by true definition is not s Smartphone. It is a multimedia device with a calling feature. The original PDA.SMart devices didn't even have calling capabilities. By true definition...the only companies that make smartphones are Palm and Blackberry. Palm is the originator.

Need i say SLAP SLAP SLAP...wake up.

Apple basically built up on the original hype they created. The iPhod is the best portable music device in history. The few offerings fromm Creative like the Nomad pioneered this. Sonly before did so with portable CD players and walkmans. However things changed. Apple had others to look at to decide on what to make that was perceived better. IPod obvious is better. Digital storage is way better tha carrying around a bunch of plastic disks. Creative had great devices, but the syle never caught on. Apple made a better syle for an existing platform. Nothing more..and they marketed well. They simply ran with it while demand was high...

Apple will be beaten...everyone gets a turn. Like u I get tired of every device being call iphone killer. Thank the medi and apple fans for that one.

[smax013]

TechieXP said:

You say what I said isn't true? Tell you what. Here is where you can get the proof. Read the DOJ report of findings of fact against MSFT in the DOJ vs MSFT. It will tell you all you need to know. Its free for all public viewing...just google it.

Nice try...but nope. There is no mention of Apple restricting development on the Mac OS or requiring a percentage of sales from Mac OS applications in the Findings of Fact. The only mentions of Apple related to Microsoft bullying Apple into including IE as the default browser over Netscape Navigator under the threat of Microsoft stopping development of Microsoft Office.

Feel free to try to find some more imaginary proof.