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8 Replies Last post: Apr 1, 2008 11:21 AM by dabigkahuna  
Click to view dabigkahuna's profile New Member 95 posts since
Jun 20, 2007
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Mar 31, 2008 2:50 AM

Benefits of Getting the Least Expensive MacBook and the Least Expensive iMac Versus Getting the MacBook Pro

Still thinking of getting a Mac. One of my big issues has been laptop (convenience) vs Imac (more bang for the buck).

The only real need for a laptop is for about 3 weeks a year when I go on vacation, but I'd really hate to give that up. On the other hand, I kinda think I'd like the separate graphics and, for a laptop, that means the Pro and if that were my choice, I might be tempted to go with the middle level ($2500).

Well, the guy at the store gave me an idea I hadn't thought about before and I thought I'd get other opinions on it. He suggested that instead of getting the $2500 macbook pro that I should get the cheapest macbook and the cheapest imac. The total cost would be $2300 (save $200) and I'd have two computers! Also means I'd have my important stuff on both for another backup. Depending on exactly when I did the purchasing, I could also benefit from getting better stuff on one.

That is, if I bought shortly after my next vacation, I'd probably buy the Imac then, almost a year later in time for my next vacation, I could get the laptop with whatever improvements they made in that time.

If the timing was such that I'd need the laptop first, I'd probably get the middle level macbook (have to have the ability to write DVDs - I miss that on my PC laptop).

So, what are your opinions and, other than portability, would the middle level macbook pro have over the bottom imac? How about compared to the next best imac (I may be tempted to go for the faster processor and better graphics even though it would bring the total to $2600 for both computers).

Also, since this is all still in the planning stage, have there been any rumors about Mac laptops or desktops coming with blue-ray read/write drives or any other notable improvements I should watch for? Right now I'm guessing I'll want to buy something within the next 12 months.

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Click to view smax013's profile Old Hand 3,913 posts since
Jan 28, 2007
1. Mar 31, 2008 1:58 PM in response to: dabigkahuna
Re: Benefits of Getting the Least Expensive MacBook and the Least Expensive iMac Versus Getting the MacBook Pro

dabigkahuna wrote:Still thinking of getting a Mac. One of my big issues has been laptop (convenience) vs Imac (more bang for the buck).

The only real need for a laptop is for about 3 weeks a year when I go on vacation, but I'd really hate to give that up. On the other hand, I kinda think I'd like the separate graphics and, for a laptop, that means the Pro and if that were my choice, I might be tempted to go with the middle level ($2500).

Well, the guy at the store gave me an idea I hadn't thought about before and I thought I'd get other opinions on it. He suggested that instead of getting the $2500 macbook pro that I should get the cheapest macbook and the cheapest imac. The total cost would be $2300 (save $200) and I'd have two computers! Also means I'd have my important stuff on both for another backup. Depending on exactly when I did the purchasing, I could also benefit from getting better stuff on one.

That is, if I bought shortly after my next vacation, I'd probably buy the Imac then, almost a year later in time for my next vacation, I could get the laptop with whatever improvements they made in that time.

If the timing was such that I'd need the laptop first, I'd probably get the middle level macbook (have to have the ability to write DVDs - I miss that on my PC laptop).

So, what are your opinions and, other than portability, would the middle level macbook pro have over the bottom imac? How about compared to the next best imac (I may be tempted to go for the faster processor and better graphics even though it would bring the total to $2600 for both computers).

Also, since this is all still in the planning stage, have there been any rumors about Mac laptops or desktops coming with blue-ray read/write drives or any other notable improvements I should watch for? Right now I'm guessing I'll want to buy something within the next 12 months.


You are facing a common dilema...and it is not just for Macs. Desktop computers ALWAYS have more bang for the buck than laptops. It is just a fact of life. Desktop components cost less that laptop components...it is more expensive to cram all that stuff into a smaller, portable package than it is into the more spacious room of a desktop computer. Not to mention you can have larger screens when you don't have to lug stuff around.


As to your general question, it is a perfectly viable option to consider. It is the path that many people take...have a desktop as the "primary" computer but then get a laptop as a second computer. That is to some degree how I operate. My laptop is kind of like my secondary computer for travel (I also use it to take into the office as I largely work from home).


As to your specific question about the mid level MacBook Pro vs. the bottom level iMac, the main thing the MacBook Pro would have over the iMac is portability and a battery. The battery means that it will operate (for a while at least) if your power goes out. Of course, you could get an APS to use with the iMac that would somewhat "level" that playing field (note completely, but somewhat). It will also have more video memory as the bottom line iMac only has 128 MB of VRAM while the mid-level MBP has 256 MB. Depending on what you will do with it, it may not really matter. The mid-level MBP also has a faster processor, but unless your doing a lot of video encoding or such, you likely will not really notice it. The definite advantage of the iMac is the bigger screen and the ability to get a much larger hard drive (if you build to order...other wise it is the same size).


As to rumors and forthcoming improvements, don't bother. Apple is EXTREMELY secretive about their upcoming products. Any rumor that you might hear is likely to have a 50% or more chance of being incorrect. If you do want to use this type of speculative thing, then feel free to check out the MacRumors.com Buyer's Guide. It give recommendations on wait/buy based upon when updates to Apple products were last done. At the moment, there are saying "wait" on an iMac since it was last updated last August and "buy" on the MacBook as it was just updated in the last month or so.


One thing to factor in is the added hassle and potential items that you might have to get in order to keep data synced between the two computers. I am not saying that it cannot be done, nor that it will necessarily be hard. I am merely making sure that you keep in mind and factor it into your decision. If you want it to be easy, then it will cost some addition money (you could use a .Mac account for example). If you want it cheap, then it might be a little bit more of a pain in the rear (i.e. the brute force method of just copying data across an ethernet cable between the two or by Firewire target disk mode...not hard, but then not really "automated" either). And don't forget that you might be forced to buy two licenses of some software if you want to use them on both computers (something like Office, you can get the Home & Student edition which allows you to install on up to three computers, but others won't be as flexible and might even have activation that would physically prevent you from installing on a second computer even if you wanted to try).


Overall, I don't see an issue with going the two computer route. Just make sure that you factor in all that costs...both actual and non-monetary.


[soapbox] Backup good...no backup bad!! [/soap box]
Click to view KellieCM's profile Community Manager 3,410 posts since
Jun 27, 2007
2. Mar 31, 2008 2:30 PM in response to: smax013
Re: Benefits of Getting the Least Expensive MacBook and the Least Expensive iMac Versus Getting the MacBook Pro
As usual, smax is right on. The only other thing I would add is that you can spend a lot of time shuttling files between both computers, and you might find that to be a pain. You will also have to buy twice the amount of software to keep them equally updated. For example, when the next revision of OSX comes out (likely not for a few years, but still) you will need to buy two copies to update both of your computers -- you can't do it with a single copy. Some software has more than one license on it (MS Office, for example) but lots of software is one license only. What good is two computers if you can't open all your files on both of them?

I personally have the mid-level MacBookPro and am very happy with it. I can't fault the iMac though, I have a 24" one as my work computer and it's really great.


Kellie Parker | Online Community Manager | PC World
Click to view smax013's profile Old Hand 3,913 posts since
Jan 28, 2007
3. Mar 31, 2008 2:39 PM in response to: KellieCM
Re: Benefits of Getting the Least Expensive MacBook and the Least Expensive iMac Versus Getting the MacBook Pro

kellie wrote:As usual, smax is right on. The only other thing I would add is that you can spend a lot of time shuttling files between both computers, and you might find that to be a pain. You will also have to buy twice the amount of software to keep them equally updated. For example, when the next revision of OSX comes out (likely not for a few years, but still) you will need to buy two copies to update both of your computers -- you can't do it with a single copy. Some software has more than one license on it (MS Office, for example) but lots of software is one license only. What good is two computers if you can't open all your files on both of them?

I personally have the mid-level MacBookPro and am very happy with it. I can't fault the iMac though, I have a 24" one as my work computer and it's really great.

For the Mac OS, you can get a family pack...not quite as expensive as buying two single licenses, but still more than just one single license. In the end, it will depend on how each software company writes their license. Some EULA's allow you to install it on a primary computer and a "backup"/laptop computer with the assumption that you will not actively be using both computer at the same time using that piece of software (and some software is "smart" enough to check the network to see if other computers are using that license).


But, again, my point was to be aware of the extra potential hassles such as moving files between two computers, updating and buying software for two computers, maintaining two computers (i.e. doing backups, downloading and installing system updates), etc.


[soapbox] Backup good...no backup bad!! [/soap box]
Click to view smax013's profile Old Hand 3,913 posts since
Jan 28, 2007
5. Mar 31, 2008 8:16 PM in response to: dabigkahuna
Re: Benefits of Getting the Least Expensive MacBook and the Least Expensive iMac Versus Getting the MacBook Pro

dabigkahuna wrote:
Good points from all. So, let's try some detail. Instead of the low level iMac, let's look at the next one up. After all, for $300 more you go from a 2.0 to 2.4 processor, resolution is better (equal to the top MBP), graphics memory is doubled (though not as good as even the mid-level MBP), only 1 gig of memory so it lags there - I'm almost positive I'd spend the extra $90 to get it to 2 gigs. Bigger and faster HD, 3 USB ports (matched only by the top MBP), not as much cache as the mid-level MBP.

So I guess the ultimate question is, with the present specs, would I lose anything noticeable compared to the mid-level MBP? I did find a site that had a long comparison of a number of Mac products and in almost every case the iMac matched the MBP, occasionally surpassing it. If they end up being about equal, then might as well get two computers rather than one. I don't know how up to date that review was though.

The possible need for double the software may be an issue, but I may also have an alternative to buying the OS twice for each upgrade. I could alternate. Thus I could upgrade the IMac for one upgrade and when the next one comes out, upgrade the MB, etc.

Other software may be an issue, especially if it checks to see that it is not duplicated. I only use one computer at a time - with my very small apartment, there certainly is no need to use two. Basically the laptop would just be for once a year vacations and I may OCCASIONALLY take it to work (my present laptop is just kinda heavy to drag around regularly!). If I can only run something on one computer, by any chance is there a process that lets people transfer the application/game from one to another computer?

As for power loss, I'm actually in good shape there. Living in Hawaii, we almost never have thunderstorms and if we do, there is a good chance it won't be where I am. I've been here over 6 years and can only recall losing power twice - once was an earthquake when all the power generators automatically shut down. Other places I've lived, I've really benefitted from having a laptop to run off batteries.

Oh, I hear the Imacs (according to that review/comparison) all have highly glossy screens with no other option. I try to have my system set up to get minimal reflection of windows, etc, but has anyone had a problem with this? I understand that glossy does give better color.

Thanks.


The mid-level MBP and the mid-level iMac are fairly on par. Whether you notice any differences would be function of what you would be using the computer for. For most typical tasks (i.e. email, web browsing, word processing, etc), you would not likely notice a difference between a Macbook and the mid-level MBP, let alone a mid-level iMac (the possible exception would be amount of RAM). For those types of tasks, processor speed and graphics cards will have little impact. If you get into video encoding/editting, then you can start to notice differences in processor speed. If you get into gaming or 3D modelling, then differences in graphcs cards will start to be apparent overall. Thus, it is not a question that is easily answered.


So software will allow you to transfer between computers easily. Others not at all. Some you can transfer a limited number of times. Again there is no easy answer...you will have to see on a software by software basis.


And, yes, the iMac is ONLY available in glossy with a glass screen "cover". I believe some have removed the glass. I will note that some people have been rather vocal about the glossy screen (i.e. they don't like it). And I guess the screens are VERY bright, which some don't really like. I don't have an iMac and have not really played around enough with one to know how I would like it. I do know that I DON'T like glossy notebook screens in general. As such, I much prefer my MacBook Pro to a MacBook for that reason alone (MacBooks are ONLY available with a glossy screen...you can choose with a MacBook Pro). My mom's MacBook does not bother me too much (not like my buddy's glossy screen on his HP 17" laptop did at least). I have to believe that there is an Apple Store in Honolulu. If you don't live on Oahu, then you might want to hop on a "sky bus" (looks like it won't be Aloha Air anymore...only Hawaiian Air) to do a day trip to Honolulu and visit the Apple store to put your hands on them (assuming there is not a local store that sells Macs).


Oh, and yes, I would likely suggest that you upgrade from 1 GB to at least 2 GB of RAM on an iMac. It is not strictly necessary like it would be for a Vista machine, but it would still be useful, especially if you like to have a lot of programs open at once. And it is not that expensive...especially if you do it yourself.


[soapbox] Backup good...no backup bad!! [/soap box]
Click to view smax013's profile Old Hand 3,913 posts since
Jan 28, 2007
7. Apr 1, 2008 4:36 AM in response to: dabigkahuna
Re: Benefits of Getting the Least Expensive MacBook and the Least Expensive iMac Versus Getting the MacBook Pro

dabigkahuna wrote:
I can narrow it down further. While I can't be sure all I'll be doing, I am always concerned about future graphics demands hurting me so I tend to want a separate graphics card (which both have) and more graphics memory. Not sure, but I think the MBP may have the better graphics card? I know it has more graphics memory. But since laptop chipsets, etc, sometimes have advantages in other areas, maybe it balances out? Don't know if the cache size differents maters much.

Besides future software requirements, there is the question of games (for Mac or running under Windows if I decide to go that route with Bootcamp, Parallels, etc. Don't get many games. Usually I just have a few I can easily kill time with. Most complicated I ever got was the original Call of Duty. Liked it a lot except for one spot in the game where so many enemy was coming at you that you pretty much had to save after each "kill" to have a chance of getting past that spot.

I don't do online games. I'm satisfied to play against the computer. I also don't like games where you have tons of weapons (I like shooters) and a bunch of situations can only be handled with a specific weapon. I prefer to get very good with just a few and focus on them. Think of the earlier Doom games.

Anyway, if the middle Imac and middle MBP would be pretty much equivalent for these things, I'd go with the Imac and just use a MB for those trips. Wouldn't have to handle games or advanced graphics stuff - those would be done on the Imac.

As I study the Mac more, I'm kinda surprised they don't have a system besides the Mac Pro that lets you change cards, etc. I know part of the Mac advantage in dependability is that it doesn't have to work with as many things as Windows, but I'd still think they would have had something cheaper than a Mac Pro for making changes. I could see that if they came out with better graphics cards on later models, I may want that rather than buying a whole new computer, but it doesn't seem to be an option.

Can the user change the hard drive later? I could see, as capacities get bigger and prices go down, that could be another thing to upgrade without buying an external.



I don't really know how the graphics cards in the MBPs stack up against the iMacs. We will have to wait for someone else to comment on that. I doubt it will be an issue for you. I suspect that the graphics card in the iMac will be more than enough for your purposes it sounds like.


As to why Apple does not have a mid-range tower, you are not the first to wonder that. In some ways it is baffling, but in others not so much. There is not NEARLY the graphics card market for the Mac as there is for the Windoze PeeCee (you cannot just go get any old graphics card sold for Windoze and pop it in...you need Mac drivers for it). It kind of becomes a chicken or an egg debate...are there no card because only the Mac Pro uses such cards or is there no mid range Mac tower because there are no graphics card options? The other factor is that Apple likely to keep their product line simple these days. It is partly to offer them more control (i.e. since they have smaller set of computer configurations, it is a LOT easier for them to test and update the OS and such when compared to Windoze...which is part of there reason why Macs are in general considered more stable than Windoze computers...if Micro$oft only had to test and program for a dozen or two at the most configurations, they likely would have fewer issues as well). But, it also makes it easier for consumers (i.e. just think how many more questions you would have if you could choose between different graphics cards to get in the iMac...you are now just debating between the same card with different VRAM and also how this card compares to what would be in a MBP). Would it be a nice thing to have mid level tower that is more modifiable? Sure thing. Is it likely to happen? I dunno...but it does not look too likely at this time, but you never know.


As to upgrading the hard drive, it can certainly be done. It is easier on some Macs than others. Mac Pro is easy as pie. I am pretty sure that the MacBook has a user replaceable/upgradeable hard drive (i.e. you can do it without voiding the warranty). I know the MacBook Pro is NOT meant to be done by users, but can be done...if you don't mind performing some minor surgery and voiding your warranty (note, I did upgrade the drive in my MacBook Pro...it was not that hard, but definitely NOT for the faint of heart...and my warranty was over anyway). I don't recall if the iMac has a user upgradeable drive or not...I don't believe so (doesn't mean it cannot be done...just likely voids the warranty and may not be too easy).


[soapbox] Backup good...no backup bad!! [/soap box]

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