12 Replies
Last post:
Jul 23, 2007 9:16 PM by
rgreen4
Remove or Dual/Boot w/Vista
JReece - you must have either a dv9000 or 9500. I have been looking at them, primarily because of the dual drives. Not too common on laptops. You must have had the second HD added, for HP usually puts two of a kind in their laptops with dual drives. Which ever, it gives you a BIG advantage. Since you complain how slow the machine is, I would lay bets that you are still using the Nortons Internet Security program. It is the source of may of the problems people complain about. My machines have all been stripped of Nortons and are running free alternatives.
Now, if this were my machine and I was going to take Vista off, this is what I would do to avoid burning bridges. Your drive with the factory Vista installation has a partition on it that is the recovery partition. Although you may not think you will ever want Vista, it should be preserved.
In your documentation somewhere it should have mentioned burning recovery discs, and it should have directed you to do that immediately. If you have not done that, then that should be your first step. I do not know how many DVD's it will take for Vista, but when my Media Center came with XP Media Center it took 4. These DVD's should be marked as recovery DVD's, put into jewel cases and put in a safe place. MPH and I wish we had a dollar for every post of someone trying to recover a laptop without them.
Next if you want to dual boot, keep in mind that drive 0 already has two partitions. My main drive no longer has the recovery partition because it now Vista, not XP MC, and I have only used 13GB. I have Vista, Quicken, Office 2007 Home & Student, Adobe Reader 8 and various utilities. You may be happier for several reasons either putting XP on the second drive and when you have it up and running, remove the Vista drive and store it. I still have the original XP MC drive with the recovery partition to my machine on a shelf.
Before you attempt to install XP, you need to go into device manager and make a list of every installed item in the list. Especially the video card, the modem, the ethernet port, the wireless adapter, etc.
Then you need to go onto the HP website, click on the lower left side button for Drivers and Downloads. It will ask for you model number, and give the product number that is on the white sticker on the bottom of the laptop. Not the serial number. When you products listing comes up, if you are lucky, it will ask which OS, XP or Vista and which version. You need to note the versions available. If XP Home is there, you are fortunate. Then you should be able to install XP Home relatively easily.
Download all the drivers you have identified and save in a separate folder. I have a download folder in my system that has all the downloads for programs and drivers in it. That way if I ever have to reinstall, I have it available and don't have to go hunting for it. You may want to rename some of the drivers for what they are, for HP uses a non-descriptive naming convention on its drivers. Once you have the drivers downloaded you are almost ready.
From this point on, we will assume that you are removing Vista from the machine in a non-permanent manner.
If you have data on the second drive, you need to move it to the primary drive so the second drive is cleared. Then turn off the computer, remove the primary drive and move the second drive into the primary position. These are SATA drives and are keyed to C: and D: by which bay they are in. In a desktop we just swap cables. When that is done, and you are ready with XP you will need to turn the PC on and insert the CD into the optical drive. You will get an error when the PC finds no operating system, but ignore it for now.
Unless you have an old Windows 98, 95, ME or 2000 disc around, you will probably have to buy the full install version of XP which will run around $200. The upgrade version will call for a previous Windows installation when it does not detect it on the PC, but, I don't think it will consider Vista to XP a recognized upgrade path. BTW, XP Pro to Vista Home Premium is not a recognized upgrade path either.
Restart the machine and you will get very early on down in the lower left corner some boot options. I don't have a dv9000 series to play with yet, but my zv5330 should be very similar as HP tends to be consistent. One option is to hit <Esc> to change Boot Order a second option is to hit <F10> to enter setup and the last option should be to hit <F12> to boot from LAN. The first option is the best bet, for you need to direct the machine to boot from the CD. Then you simply follow the CD's instructions to format the drive and install XP. XP will by default install generic driver for everything that it has to have. When it is finished the machine is very basic, and will probably have very poor graphics, but you need at this point to to create a download folder and copy the downloaded drivers from the Vista drive which is now in the secondary position into this folder. Then turn off the machine and remove the Vista drive.
Restart the machine, start Windows Explorer and go to the downloads folder and if the driver download is the normal HP softpak you will need to double click on it to exapand it. This is determined if it is an .EXE file. Then go into device manager, and one by one, double click on the devices and in the dialog box, click on update driver. In the next dialog box it will ask if you want to connect to the internet to seach for better drivers, for all updates at this point, check the not at this time box, and click on next. In the next dialog box check on Install from specific location (Advanced) and click on next. In the next dialog box uncheck update from removable media (CD) and check Include this location and click on browse. Now point the computer to the exact folder with the driver for this device and click next. XP will do the rest.
Then reinstall the programs you intend to use you should be ready. I apologize for the long detailed post, but it is not a difficult process, just involved.
I would at this point purchase another 2.5" SATA laptop drive and install it in the second bay as a data drive. At some point in the future, you ever want to revert to Vista, you simply swap out the XP drive for the Vista drive. It's not a dual boot but the bridge is still intact. If you want to burn the bride, then you format the Vista drive and turn it into a data drive, and if you want to revert to Vista, you will need the Recovery DVD's you burnd at the start of this process.
Now, if this were my machine and I was going to take Vista off, this is what I would do to avoid burning bridges. Your drive with the factory Vista installation has a partition on it that is the recovery partition. Although you may not think you will ever want Vista, it should be preserved.
In your documentation somewhere it should have mentioned burning recovery discs, and it should have directed you to do that immediately. If you have not done that, then that should be your first step. I do not know how many DVD's it will take for Vista, but when my Media Center came with XP Media Center it took 4. These DVD's should be marked as recovery DVD's, put into jewel cases and put in a safe place. MPH and I wish we had a dollar for every post of someone trying to recover a laptop without them.
Next if you want to dual boot, keep in mind that drive 0 already has two partitions. My main drive no longer has the recovery partition because it now Vista, not XP MC, and I have only used 13GB. I have Vista, Quicken, Office 2007 Home & Student, Adobe Reader 8 and various utilities. You may be happier for several reasons either putting XP on the second drive and when you have it up and running, remove the Vista drive and store it. I still have the original XP MC drive with the recovery partition to my machine on a shelf.
Before you attempt to install XP, you need to go into device manager and make a list of every installed item in the list. Especially the video card, the modem, the ethernet port, the wireless adapter, etc.
Then you need to go onto the HP website, click on the lower left side button for Drivers and Downloads. It will ask for you model number, and give the product number that is on the white sticker on the bottom of the laptop. Not the serial number. When you products listing comes up, if you are lucky, it will ask which OS, XP or Vista and which version. You need to note the versions available. If XP Home is there, you are fortunate. Then you should be able to install XP Home relatively easily.
Download all the drivers you have identified and save in a separate folder. I have a download folder in my system that has all the downloads for programs and drivers in it. That way if I ever have to reinstall, I have it available and don't have to go hunting for it. You may want to rename some of the drivers for what they are, for HP uses a non-descriptive naming convention on its drivers. Once you have the drivers downloaded you are almost ready.
From this point on, we will assume that you are removing Vista from the machine in a non-permanent manner.
If you have data on the second drive, you need to move it to the primary drive so the second drive is cleared. Then turn off the computer, remove the primary drive and move the second drive into the primary position. These are SATA drives and are keyed to C: and D: by which bay they are in. In a desktop we just swap cables. When that is done, and you are ready with XP you will need to turn the PC on and insert the CD into the optical drive. You will get an error when the PC finds no operating system, but ignore it for now.
Unless you have an old Windows 98, 95, ME or 2000 disc around, you will probably have to buy the full install version of XP which will run around $200. The upgrade version will call for a previous Windows installation when it does not detect it on the PC, but, I don't think it will consider Vista to XP a recognized upgrade path. BTW, XP Pro to Vista Home Premium is not a recognized upgrade path either.
Restart the machine and you will get very early on down in the lower left corner some boot options. I don't have a dv9000 series to play with yet, but my zv5330 should be very similar as HP tends to be consistent. One option is to hit <Esc> to change Boot Order a second option is to hit <F10> to enter setup and the last option should be to hit <F12> to boot from LAN. The first option is the best bet, for you need to direct the machine to boot from the CD. Then you simply follow the CD's instructions to format the drive and install XP. XP will by default install generic driver for everything that it has to have. When it is finished the machine is very basic, and will probably have very poor graphics, but you need at this point to to create a download folder and copy the downloaded drivers from the Vista drive which is now in the secondary position into this folder. Then turn off the machine and remove the Vista drive.
Restart the machine, start Windows Explorer and go to the downloads folder and if the driver download is the normal HP softpak you will need to double click on it to exapand it. This is determined if it is an .EXE file. Then go into device manager, and one by one, double click on the devices and in the dialog box, click on update driver. In the next dialog box it will ask if you want to connect to the internet to seach for better drivers, for all updates at this point, check the not at this time box, and click on next. In the next dialog box check on Install from specific location (Advanced) and click on next. In the next dialog box uncheck update from removable media (CD) and check Include this location and click on browse. Now point the computer to the exact folder with the driver for this device and click next. XP will do the rest.
Then reinstall the programs you intend to use you should be ready. I apologize for the long detailed post, but it is not a difficult process, just involved.
I would at this point purchase another 2.5" SATA laptop drive and install it in the second bay as a data drive. At some point in the future, you ever want to revert to Vista, you simply swap out the XP drive for the Vista drive. It's not a dual boot but the bridge is still intact. If you want to burn the bride, then you format the Vista drive and turn it into a data drive, and if you want to revert to Vista, you will need the Recovery DVD's you burnd at the start of this process.
XP Home Transfer
I am not certain. I do know that all the copies of Vista OEM sold on the internet retailers such as Newegg, specifically warn that the copy is valid for use only on one machine. Shorty after getting active with the forums, there was a post by an upset individual who had to have a motherboard replaced on a laptop, and could not reinstall Vista as it was showing up as a second machine.
Theat warning is not present on the OEM copies of XP.
This is the disclaimer on a Vista OEM Product:
quote:ab332f67f9Disclaimer: This OEM software is intended for system builders only and cannot be transferred to another PC once it is installed. The purchaser of this software is required to comply with the terms of the System Builder license, including the responsibility of providing all end user support for the software. http://www.microsoft.com/ oem/sblicense/default.mspx[/quote:ab332f67f9]
The bright red highlights are mine.
This is the disclaimer on an XP OEM Product:
quote:ab332f67f9Disclaimer: Qualifying proof of purchase must be recent receipts showing the purchase of a mother board, hard drive, RAM and a CPU. The components can be on multiple receipts; not necessarily all on one receipt nor on the same receipt as the qualifying Windows XP/Office 2003 that you purchased. [/quote:ab332f67f9]
If your 80GB HD is empty or can be easily emptied by moving all your data to the 120 in C:, it won't cost you anything to try. The worst thing that will happen is that MS will refuse to permit activation, which would require a phone call to Microsoft to beg absolution. Again, the worst they can do is say No. On the other hand if they say yes and give you the code to put into the machine, you will save some money. You must, however, use the COA that is on the bottom of your old machine.
If you are not sucessful, you will neet to pick up a copy of XP. Going back to what I would do if it were my machine, I would pick up a new drive for the laptop, and put it in the second drive bay. Then you download all the drivers needed onto that drive. Then you remove the Vista drive out of the primary bay and put it on the closet shelf, and put the 80GB in its place and install XP on that drive. Then to install the drivers, you just point to the secondary drive. Once you have everything up and running, you simply use the new drive for data, and the 80GB in the primary for OS and Programs. But mph knew I would do that.:roll:
You are right about the 9339 it has some very nice specs and a good price. I was working with another member, and we actually wound up trading e-mails. I got one a few days ago when he finally was able to get his. I was tempted when I saw the specs, and to answer you question about the 200GB, it think it is because 100GB HD are not in the supply chain. I actually thought it was one 200GB, and the two HD setup is what I wanted. I am getting my specs together to call HP and order my new laptop. I am having trouble deciding between the 17" 9500 and the 15.4" white 6500 Special Edition, but I am probably going with the larger one.
I also picked up a 20" x 14" wooden cutting board. Some people promot the use of a cooler pad, but they are designed to get the heat out from under the laptop, but as you know HP and Compaq discharges the heat out one side, not the bottom. The biggest thing is to keep the bottom vents open so the fans have an air source. Using a laptop on ones lap usually covers those which causes the laptop to heat up.
My old zv5330us (By the way us is the US mkt) has the CPU on the right side and the main vent is on the right side also. The area to the right of the touchpad is warm on this machine.
Theat warning is not present on the OEM copies of XP.
This is the disclaimer on a Vista OEM Product:
quote:ab332f67f9Disclaimer: This OEM software is intended for system builders only and cannot be transferred to another PC once it is installed. The purchaser of this software is required to comply with the terms of the System Builder license, including the responsibility of providing all end user support for the software. http://www.microsoft.com/ oem/sblicense/default.mspx[/quote:ab332f67f9]
The bright red highlights are mine.
This is the disclaimer on an XP OEM Product:
quote:ab332f67f9Disclaimer: Qualifying proof of purchase must be recent receipts showing the purchase of a mother board, hard drive, RAM and a CPU. The components can be on multiple receipts; not necessarily all on one receipt nor on the same receipt as the qualifying Windows XP/Office 2003 that you purchased. [/quote:ab332f67f9]
If your 80GB HD is empty or can be easily emptied by moving all your data to the 120 in C:, it won't cost you anything to try. The worst thing that will happen is that MS will refuse to permit activation, which would require a phone call to Microsoft to beg absolution. Again, the worst they can do is say No. On the other hand if they say yes and give you the code to put into the machine, you will save some money. You must, however, use the COA that is on the bottom of your old machine.
If you are not sucessful, you will neet to pick up a copy of XP. Going back to what I would do if it were my machine, I would pick up a new drive for the laptop, and put it in the second drive bay. Then you download all the drivers needed onto that drive. Then you remove the Vista drive out of the primary bay and put it on the closet shelf, and put the 80GB in its place and install XP on that drive. Then to install the drivers, you just point to the secondary drive. Once you have everything up and running, you simply use the new drive for data, and the 80GB in the primary for OS and Programs. But mph knew I would do that.:roll:
You are right about the 9339 it has some very nice specs and a good price. I was working with another member, and we actually wound up trading e-mails. I got one a few days ago when he finally was able to get his. I was tempted when I saw the specs, and to answer you question about the 200GB, it think it is because 100GB HD are not in the supply chain. I actually thought it was one 200GB, and the two HD setup is what I wanted. I am getting my specs together to call HP and order my new laptop. I am having trouble deciding between the 17" 9500 and the 15.4" white 6500 Special Edition, but I am probably going with the larger one.
I also picked up a 20" x 14" wooden cutting board. Some people promot the use of a cooler pad, but they are designed to get the heat out from under the laptop, but as you know HP and Compaq discharges the heat out one side, not the bottom. The biggest thing is to keep the bottom vents open so the fans have an air source. Using a laptop on ones lap usually covers those which causes the laptop to heat up.
My old zv5330us (By the way us is the US mkt) has the CPU on the right side and the main vent is on the right side also. The area to the right of the touchpad is warm on this machine.
BIOS
I had not heard that. But then I haven't gotten that deep into them yet.
Have you considered downloading one of the temperature monitoring programs. Sometimes heat is more noticeable to our touch than harmfull to the CPU. I know in desktops in opening one up that has been running a while, you will burn your fingers if you touch the heatsink close to the processor.
Have you considered downloading one of the temperature monitoring programs. Sometimes heat is more noticeable to our touch than harmfull to the CPU. I know in desktops in opening one up that has been running a while, you will burn your fingers if you touch the heatsink close to the processor.
Drive Temperature
The one drive that is at 124F is very warm. The other temperatures do not seem to be too far out of line. Drives do get very warm. Which drive is at 124F?
On the Seagate/Maxtor Website - from the knowledge base:
quote:52e2b4c5cfAll Maxtor ATA, SATA, and SCSI drives can operate with or without a fan, providing the hard disk temperature does not exceed 131F (55C) as measured from the top cover of the drive. Reliability will be compromised when the drive is exposed to temperatures above 55C or 131F.[/quote:52e2b4c5cf]
On the Seagate/Maxtor Website - from the knowledge base:
quote:52e2b4c5cfAll Maxtor ATA, SATA, and SCSI drives can operate with or without a fan, providing the hard disk temperature does not exceed 131F (55C) as measured from the top cover of the drive. Reliability will be compromised when the drive is exposed to temperatures above 55C or 131F.[/quote:52e2b4c5cf]
Re: Drive Temperature
rgreen4 wrote:The one drive that is at 124F is very warm. The other temperatures do not seem to be too far out of line. Drives do get very warm. Which drive is at 124F?
On the Seagate/Maxtor Website - from the knowledge base:
quote:ccf8f13741All Maxtor ATA, SATA, and SCSI drives can operate with or without a fan, providing the hard disk temperature does not exceed 131F (55C) as measured from the top cover of the drive. Reliability will be compromised when the drive is exposed to temperatures above 55C or 131F.[/quote:ccf8f13741]
On the Seagate/Maxtor Website - from the knowledge base:
quote:ccf8f13741All Maxtor ATA, SATA, and SCSI drives can operate with or without a fan, providing the hard disk temperature does not exceed 131F (55C) as measured from the top cover of the drive. Reliability will be compromised when the drive is exposed to temperatures above 55C or 131F.[/quote:ccf8f13741]
You are very close to the max.
I don't know about the 9000/9500, but my zv5330us has no access from the drive bay into the main compartment of the laptop, so the drive does not get much cooling. Most of the time the drives are not working that hard, but extensive disk operations could run this temp up.
You might leave the machine on for a period of time with no activity and then read the temps.
Vista and XP
The reason I say to keep the original Vista disc is that at some point in the future, you will want to convert back to Vista. It might not seem so at the moment or in the immediate future, but the Vista vs XP argument is just like the XP vs Win98 arguments of 2001, with one major difference only - the activation issue. In 2001 existing users were agast at the activation issue, griping about the lack of available drivers, and complaining about the instability of XP.
Within two years, the overwhelming majority of users had converted to XP and Win98 started dying on the vine. The same process will take place with XP and Vista. If you are absolutely certain that you will NEVER need Vista, be my guest and format the HD. Given the availability and low prices for replacement HD,'s it just seems to me a cheap insurance polity to be able to pop that drive back in the machine at some time in the future and be back in operation. It might even be able to be used to rescue the XP boot drive if there are problems. There is another post about someone who apparently has a damaged OS, and no recovery disc. If they could pop in a Vista disc, copy off their data and then reinstall XP on the disc and then copy the data back they would be deliriously happy.
I do not believe in burning my bridges any more (I have made these types of mistakes in the past, so when people charge ahead and delete Vista without forethought I cringe). You have made all the correct preparations, so I am just cautioning you that the Vista installation on that drive may be more valuable to you in the future than the physical drive.
Newegg lists 120GB SATA drives between $67 and $80. You have burned the recovery DVD's, so that is the restore plan A. For plan B (always have a back door) after you register your dv9500, order the recovery discs from HP.
Then acquire a legal copy of XP and install on the current drive. Use the second 120 as a data disc. There is not enough price difference between the 80GB and the 120GB worth shortchanging the storage (In my humble opinion).
SATA drives determine which is the first device by the port to which they are attached. On a desktop, we just swap data/signal cables, and C is now D, and D is now C. In a laptop the drive bays do this. According to the document Laptop Tour for the 9000/9500 series, the primary bay is directly below the left side of the keyboard panel. When the laptop is flipped side to side so the bottom is up, then the primary bay is on the right side. If that HD has an OS, it will boot from that drive, if it does not, it may try to boot from the other drive. If both have bootable OS, it may give you a choice. Thus, you can leave the current Vista drive in bay 2 and if the drive in bay 1 has an OS, you will probably get an option on boot asking which drive you wish to boot from. You will have created a dual boot system. Since I don't have my 9500 yet - I will order it next week, I can't experiment.
Within two years, the overwhelming majority of users had converted to XP and Win98 started dying on the vine. The same process will take place with XP and Vista. If you are absolutely certain that you will NEVER need Vista, be my guest and format the HD. Given the availability and low prices for replacement HD,'s it just seems to me a cheap insurance polity to be able to pop that drive back in the machine at some time in the future and be back in operation. It might even be able to be used to rescue the XP boot drive if there are problems. There is another post about someone who apparently has a damaged OS, and no recovery disc. If they could pop in a Vista disc, copy off their data and then reinstall XP on the disc and then copy the data back they would be deliriously happy.
I do not believe in burning my bridges any more (I have made these types of mistakes in the past, so when people charge ahead and delete Vista without forethought I cringe). You have made all the correct preparations, so I am just cautioning you that the Vista installation on that drive may be more valuable to you in the future than the physical drive.
Newegg lists 120GB SATA drives between $67 and $80. You have burned the recovery DVD's, so that is the restore plan A. For plan B (always have a back door) after you register your dv9500, order the recovery discs from HP.
Then acquire a legal copy of XP and install on the current drive. Use the second 120 as a data disc. There is not enough price difference between the 80GB and the 120GB worth shortchanging the storage (In my humble opinion).
SATA drives determine which is the first device by the port to which they are attached. On a desktop, we just swap data/signal cables, and C is now D, and D is now C. In a laptop the drive bays do this. According to the document Laptop Tour for the 9000/9500 series, the primary bay is directly below the left side of the keyboard panel. When the laptop is flipped side to side so the bottom is up, then the primary bay is on the right side. If that HD has an OS, it will boot from that drive, if it does not, it may try to boot from the other drive. If both have bootable OS, it may give you a choice. Thus, you can leave the current Vista drive in bay 2 and if the drive in bay 1 has an OS, you will probably get an option on boot asking which drive you wish to boot from. You will have created a dual boot system. Since I don't have my 9500 yet - I will order it next week, I can't experiment.
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